Stop me before I glue this up

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by nomadlogo, Nov 14, 2013.

  1. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    Quick and simple (yeah right), I have an ejector pit in the basement (converted overhead sewer from underground) that I am plumbing a 3 piece bathroom into. I have dug up some, ok a lot, of concrete and have a mocked up some piped in the trench. Now I need to know why it will not work or if it will before I glue it up and cover it.

    From left to right - 4" to 3" reducer to 3x3x2 Wye on a tilt (30-40 degrees maybe). Street 90 and straight to future shower (p trap). Continues with 3" to a 3x3x2 WYE that is slightly tilted (trying to keep it straight for the up pipe) that goes to a street 90 - 2" that will be Lav and vent up. Continue we have 3" pipe to 3x3x3 with 3" to 2" bushing. WYE 3" goes to toilet with a 3" street 45 then to a standard 3" 90. Bushing on top of WYE goes to a 2" WYE (very slightly tilted) that is venting with a street 90 up. The top of that WYE goes to a p-trap for a floor drain. The vent pipes all tie up to a vent (1.5", I know I should go bigger but that is all that was there for the ejector pit, and yeah probably shouldn't share it with pit either).

    Any thoughts

    See picture
    Bathroom_Rough2.jpg
  2. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    Ok... in looking at it some more, there is no real reason I cannot turn the WYE after the toilet up for the vent and then do the same for the Lav. That would just move my proposed wall in a bit. Seems like Wye's that are mostly flat (horizontal) like my picture are frowned upon for venting.
  3. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,053
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    The sbower needs a vent before it enters the main line.
    The lav is vented above the santee is fine. If you had a combo or wye on it's back for the lav, you could continue on for the floor drain. The lav would be wet venting the shower drain. That's one less pipe coming out of the ground.
    Except now I've added one for the shower.
  4. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    Terry - Thanks for the response.

    Would the Shower (left of picture) not be using the sink (middle) as a wet vent in the setup? I have added a picture with the 2 wye's turned up, first (second wye in line from left) for sink (an up to vent) and second (4th wye in line) for toilet's vent. Bathroom_Rough3.jpg
  5. hboogz

    hboogz Member

    Messages:
    41
    Location:
    New York
    Screenshot_2013-11-15_09-45-30.jpg Great Thread. I'm a beginner and was wondering if you could identify some of the items I've marked up based on your picture.

    Green Circle: Is that santee going to a main drain and then a sewage ejector? I believe that's a 3x4X2 ?
    Blue Circle: Is that what the pro's call putting a santee on "its back" ?
    Red Circle: Is that the vent stack ?

    is the difference between calling the fitting a wye or santee is its application/usage. To the untrained eye, they are all similar save for the opening sizes.

    Thanks!
  6. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    Terry - i think I found the answer to my question. The shower is wet vented (in some actuality) but since the toilet it upstream it would cause an issue. Is this correct? So when the toilet is flushed it would be better to have it pull air from the shower vent versus potentially pulling the water out of the trap?? I broke up a little more concrete and added a vent for the shower. How are we looking now. Bathroom_Rough4.jpg
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2013
  7. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    Hboogz... I described all the fittings in the first post, but just to recap

    Green Circle = That is a 3x3x2 Wye with the 2" segment running to a shower off of a street 90 (2"). The 3 inch segment to the left is connected to a reducer 4" to 3" that is connected to the ejector pit.

    Blue Circle = A 3"x3"x3" WYE that has a Street 3" 45 connecting to a 3" 90 for the toilet. This WYE if it was all-in one would be called a Combo. There is no sanitary T in this layout (at least as far as by the names I am familiar with). The back part of that particular WYE has a 3" to 2" bushing to allow the smaller WYE (2"x2x2) to be connected. Which is your Red Circle.

    Red Circle - Is a Vent for the toilet. With a emergency drain floor drain P-trap right after it.

    Hope that helps some.

    Thanks
  8. hboogz

    hboogz Member

    Messages:
    41
    Location:
    New York
    Thanks for the clarification nomad.
  9. cacher_chick

    cacher_chick Test, Don't Guess!

    Messages:
    3,248
    Location:
    Land of Cheese
    The wyes for the vents must be turned upward so the dry vent is never running at an angle lower than 45 degrees.
  10. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,053
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    Any horizontal change of direction should be a wye or long turn 90.
  11. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    @cacher_chick - you say wye(s) indicating more than one but I take it in my last posted picture you are referring to the single newly added shower vent to on the left (or you were just responding to my early post). For the latter, the I should be able to turn that to 45 degrees and still hit the wall that is going to go around the ejector pit so that should be good. Does everything else in the latest picture pass the smell test then? Thank you for your comments.

    @Terry - Do I have a horizontal change of direction not using a WYE. My first connection is a WYE+90 to the shower P Trap with an immediate WYE for the newly added Vent. If you are referencing cacher's point about the WYE rotated up for that new shower vent, that makes sense. If not, I am not quite sure which part you are referencing. I do appreciate all the help.
  12. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,185
    Location:
    Maine
    The wye and elbow serving as the shower vent. The wye can't be flat like you have it with that short piece in the elbow. No part of the vent can be horizontal until it has risen 6" above the flood level of the highest fixture in the group (the lav)
  13. Reach4

    Reach4 Active Member

    Messages:
    2,303
    Location:
    IL
    I think Terry is referring to part C. huge5.jpg
    Is that ground water at U?

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Nov 15, 2013
  14. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    @Tom Sawyer - yeah, cacher_chick mention that and I have since turned the WYE up and used a street 45 to get it to be "somewhat vertical" for the vent pipe.

    @Reach4 - I gotcha, so that normal 90 would likely be a choke point... A long sweep 90 it is, which means some more concrete breaking. As for U in your photo, that is not ground water but the location where the floor drain is (was) and I have the Furnace just dripping down the concrete into the hole right now. Will vac it out before backfilling.

    UPDATE: I broke up some more concrete and swapped out for the long sweep 90. To get the vent to get level I had to add 22, is this allowable. You will notice in the second picture the vent is above 45 (so vertical).
    Bathroom_Rough5.jpg Bathroom_Rough5Close.jpg
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2013
  15. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,185
    Location:
    Maine
  16. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    Nice... Any other issues that standout or does it look ready for glue (some testing), backfill, and some concrete?
  17. asktom

    asktom Member

    Messages:
    567
    Location:
    Victor, MT
    I think I would have tied the floor drain in with a 3X2 wye between B & H (with K an 1/8) and run back parallel to J with a vent back there (combo rolled to an 1/8) so it was vented before and tied in past the toilet vent. What you have should work (if you fix the shower vent & use a LS 1/4 as mentioned above) but don't think it meets the letter of the law, depending on what the law is in your burg. (Note: I am a UPC guy). Is the floor drain going to have a trap primer? Are you going to dump the furnace condensate into it? I notice nary a cleanout.
  18. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    asktom - My previous pictures shows the long sweep 90 for the shower drain, so I think i am to the workable stage. Is your reasoning for moving the floor drain to closer in line to eliminate the concern that the toilet would be siphoning the trap? I was under the impression the toilet vent being behind the toilet would make it more likely it sucks air than siphons the trap. As for the floor drain, I will drain the furnace into it so it should keep the trap full all year (high efficiency so drips in the winter and A/C in summer + humidifier).

    As for clean-outs, it goes right into the ejector pit on the left so there is a big 4" clean-out there ;) I will also put a cleanout in the lav and toilet vents, but that is work after the ground is closed back in with cement.
  19. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,185
    Location:
    Maine
    Personally, I would delete the floor drain.
  20. nomadlogo

    nomadlogo New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Indiana
    Tom Sawyer - At the moment I have no other good alternative for the HVAC condensate to go other than the floor drain. Are you saying delete it due to the connection being after the toilet?
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