Soldering removed; flux residue remains?

[BridgitWolf]

Hi All! I hope someone can help me with this problem... single DIY mom here...

I had a leaky hot water valve underneath my kitchen sink, so I set about replacing it: I heated up the valve fitting, removed it, polished the exposed copper as best I could, fluxed, and tried to sweat a new fitting in its place. I mangled the job! I probably used too much flux, and didn't get the old pipes clean enough... Anyway, I didn't even run water through the pipe, I could see that the sweating job wasn't going to hold.

So, I just cut the pipe below the first fitting, and installed a whole new pipe assembly and valve using Lowe's compression fittings. Water flows great now -- but the hot water has a horrible smell/taste! I'm guessing that it's fumes from the burnt flux that migrated through the pipes...? Is that typical? I tried running hot water for 10 minutes, but the smell doesn't seem to go away.

Also, this hot water line T's off to the dishwasher, which also gets the stinky water -- so I guess the smell migrated into that hose too... I figured I'd have to replace all the lines downstream of the section that I originally sweated and replaced. Does anyone have advice for an easier fix, or any experience with something like this?

Thanks, B

 

[Reach4]

No experience. You could try turning off the WH to avoid wasting energy. Then turn on the problem faucet to a dribble overnight or longer. See if that washes away the smell+taste.

 

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[JRC3]

Does it smell like rotten eggs? I'd go check the bathroom fixtures to see what the hot water smalls like there. Could be another problem altogether.

 

[BridgitWolf]

Thanks -- no smell/taste through any of the other taps in the house. Also, the cold water for that sink is fine after a few seconds of turning off the hot.

 

[BridgitWolf]

Anyone else have insight about this? Is it really possible for those fumes to migrate up to the water line (and faucet?) and affect the smell of the water so much?

 

[Reach4]

It is hard to know how strong the smell is. Flux can be acidic, but it should wash out normally. You did not describe the taste/smell other than "horrible". A barely detectable taste/smell might be be viewed as horrible, right?

This paragraph is a digression: So how could one quantify? There is a test for hot peppers associated with the Scoville scale. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scoville_scale The original method was to dilute the pepper juice with water. If it was barely detected when diluted with 99 parts sugar water to 1 part pepper, it had a Scoville rating of 100. If you diluted your horrible water with problem-free water, what dilution would it take before a tester who did not prepare the sample could or could not tell the difference? I know you are not going to do the experiment.

Do you have the brand and part number/name for the flux you used?

Any thoughts about trickling water through all night or other period? If you could go at about 2 to 5 gallons per hour, it would not take much water. You could do it with the hot water heater on or off... Off saves fuel/power. Even if that flow fixes it, it would be interesting to know what flux you used.

 

[BridgitWolf]

Thanks again for the reply. Looking now, I may have also figured out why my sweating job was so bad -- I used Benzomatic's water-soluble flux. Though, this also makes it a little more puzzling why the smell remains. (That is, shouldn't it all have rinsed out by now?)

Anyway, sure, I have no problem with running a slow trickle all night. Maybe that will rinse it out.

Regarding the smell/taste: When I turn the hot water full on, any steam smells powerfully of burnt metal (and of the smell I largely associate with sweating copper, which I've done successfully in the past, and helped my father do at his refrigeration contracting business, when he was alive). I need only stand within 2-3 feet of the sink to smell it. After a few minutes of running, the smell seems to diminish. However, if I turn off the tap, then turn it on 10 minutes later, the smell has returned just as strong as before.

I tasted the water briefly after I fixed the line, and spit it out. Correct: I will not be tasting it again. Smell offers perhaps a better, if just as subjective, metric for how "tainted" the water is.

Thanks again for any help.

 

[Reach4]

http://edmfast.com/images/msds/ml1113.pdf is the material safety data sheet.

That includes Ammonium fume -- maybe the same as Ammonium chloride fume https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npg/npgd0029.html https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sal_ammoniac

"fume" as an ingredient??? http://www.ilpi.com/msds/ref/fume.html has a definition... but its hard to see how a fume can be an ingredient.

Anyway, I would dribble the water. It would be nice if somebody knows about this effect, but in the mean time, it would be nice to reduce/eliminate the smell/taste.

 

[DonL]

I tasted the water briefly after I fixed the line, and spit it out. Correct: I will not be tasting it again. Smell offers perhaps a better, if just as subjective, metric for how "tainted" the water is.

If you have a electric water heater and turned your water off without turning the power off to the water heater you may have melted a element.

Just a guess. Is your water heater electric ?

Good Luck.

 

[Jadnashua]

The smell in the water will dissipate, but it can take awhile. The recommendations are to use the water soluble flux and the lead-free solder, so you did not use the wrong stuff (although it is a bit harder for a new-bee to make a good joint without some practice). It sounds like you used a bit more flux than needed, and if you overheated the joint, those fumes go both inside the pipe and outside. My preference on flux is a tinning flux that has some powdered solder in it verses that that does not have any. I find it easier to use, but someone who does it every day can use any.

 

[BridgitWolf]

Thanks again, folks. Gas water heater, and water was only shut at a basement valve b/t heater and kitchen line.

@jadnashua -- Thanks. Certainly overheated the joints, so I guess the fumes stuck in the pipes, and in the hoses feeding to the dishwasher and sink. I'm going to replace those hoses this weekend, because they're rubber (and metal mesh covered) and likely absorbed those fumes and is making it hard for it to flush out. Hopefully that will solve it. I did the trickle last night, with no good results.

But I'm open to other explanations and solutions -- anyone?

 

[Jadnashua]

FWIW, it's easier to burn the water based fluxes than the old ones that preceded them. The reason why I like the tinning fluxes is that you can see when the powdered solder in them starts to melt, and you know the joint is hot enough to add what you need from the roll. While you can still overheat things, you won't if you are watching. Without it, it takes more skill.

 

[Themp]

I am going to assume you have shutoffs for the sink and dishwasher hose connections. So, when you replace the hoses(just disconnect the supply side), and before you put on the new ones. Run the water from the sink and then the dishwasher side into a bucket or large pan and see if you have the smell. If you have the smell then you have to resolve this first otherwise you will contaminate the new hoses. You could buy an extra hose connection that is longer than you need that would help get the water to a bucket.

Now if you have the smell with the hoses off, then turn the water off at the main and then drain the sink/dishwasher line by opening a faucet that is lower than the sink/dishwasher. Now you can feed some kind of cleaner back in the line. Now what cleaner to use I am stumped on. You could call and ask what would be the best cleaner solution for:

http://www.bernzomatic.com/product/swsf100-1-oz-water-soluble-plumbing-flux/

Then again by running a solution backwards in the pipes are you pushing the problem down the line. Again I am just throwing some things out here. Or get one of these and use it to brush as far back as you can in the pipe while it is empty and then turn on the water again to flush:

http://www.brushtechbrushes.com/48-flexible-brush-for-vinyl-tubes.html