Slab Leak or not

[teqp]

I have checked the water meter at the street for a leak. The water bill has gotten much higher in the last 2 billing cycles compared to last year. Here is my issue, I have 2 shutoff valves, one for the house water and one for the sprinkler system. When I have both valves on the red triangle at the street meter turns quite a bit. When I shut off the sprinkler valve, the red triangle will slow down quite a bit. I assume I have a leak on the sprinkler water line, but cannot see any water spots around the house. Now with the sprinkler valve still shut off, if I turn off the house water valve the red triangle will stop spinning. If I turn the main water valve back on, after about an hour or so, the red triangle will be slowly spinning again. If I turn the main valve off again it will stop, but then eventually start spinning again once I turn it back on. Does this mean I also have a slab leak? I searched the forum but could not find my example.

I appreciate any of the experts advice in advance. Thanks and Happy Holidays.

 

[Terry]

The irrigation system seems to have a leak. Get that repaired first.

The house is good for an hour, then spins a bit. You have have a toilet flapper that leaks, or you now have new ice cubes.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[teqp]

Thank you for the fast response. So if I turn off the water line on all toilets, it should not spin, correct? I was pretty sure I have a leak on the irrigation side and need to get that repaired.

No new ice cubes as we don't have the refrigerator water line hooked up.

 

[Terry]

Yes. That's what I'm thinking at least.

 

[Dj2]

From what you are describing, it sounds like you have a leak in the sprinkler line for sure.

Not all leaks show up on the surface, slab driveway or lawn - as the water could be draining down.

Locating the leak may be challenging and if you can't it, under certain conditions, you may have to replace the line.

If you turn the toilet supply valves off and the red triangle keeps on spinning - you have a leak in the main to the house as well.

 

[Jadnashua]

If you shut the supply line to the toilet(s) off, not only check the water meter to see if it stopped moving, but also pop the tank cover and see if the water level dropped...a classic sign that the flapper valve is leaking.

 

[teqp]

Thanks all for the information, I appreciate it. So I believe I found the main culprit. It appears that my RO water under my sink keeps making noise as if asking for water even if the tank is full. There is no leak under the sink but it kept making noise. I shut off its water valve and after 60 minutes the red triangle didn't move. I left it off for 4 hours as we went out last night. I came back and the main water line indicated that it moved 0.05 cubic feet over the 4 hours based on the before and after photos I took. This amounts to about 0.37 gallons over that time. Once I shut off the RO water line the triangle wasn't moving. I still need to shut off the toilet valves or test with dye, which I will do probably tomorrow.

I do need to figure out why the RO keeps using water even though the tank is full. This is the second home that this RO has been installed in and we didn't have this problem in the first house. If anyone has an idea as to why this is happening, I would appreciate any input.

As for the irrigation line, I will keep its valve shut off for now and see if I can locate the leak myself before calling a plumber. We have drought tolerant landscape so the sprinklers aren't needed too much.

Happy Holidays!

 

[Bluebinky]

Possibly a leak at the dispenser. Also, the "automatic shutoff valve" may be messed up or hooked up wrong.

 

[Reach4]

I don't know why your shut off is not working. If you ever replace this system, note they have systems with "zero waste" because the route the reject water to the hot water system.

They also have a "Zero Waste Reverse Osmosis Retrofit Kit" that you could consider. Looking at http://www.filtersfast.com/watts_zero_waste_retro_kit.pdf it looks as if the parts in that kit replace the existing shut off valve. See how you read it. So that kit should repair your unit and save water over how it worked initially.

 

[teqp]

Possibly a leak at the dispenser. Also, the "automatic shutoff valve" may be messed up or hooked up wrong.

No leak at the dispenser. The automatic shutoff valve was not hooked up wrong as it worked fine for 2.5 years. I assume the shutoff valve has gone bad, so order a new one. For less than $7 it is worth trying to see if this fixes this issue.

I will be testing the toilets today to see if any of them are causing the 0.05 cu ft per 4 hour leak.

Thanks again for the replies, they are appreciated.

 

[Reach4]

I will be testing the toilets today to see if any of them are causing the 0.05 cu ft per 4 hour leak.

That's about 0.1 gallons per hour.

 

[teqp]

No leak at the dispenser. The automatic shutoff valve was not hooked up wrong as it worked fine for 2.5 years. I assume the shutoff valve has gone bad, so order a new one. For less than $7 it is worth trying to see if this fixes this issue.

I will be testing the toilets today to see if any of them are causing the 0.05 cu ft per 4 hour leak.

Thanks again for the replies, they are appreciated.

Ok, so I shut off all toilet water lines and there was about a 0.004 cu ft increase at the main water line. This is equates to 0.03 gallons/ 2.5 hours.

Is this something that is normal or should I keep investigating? Thank you again for the replies.

 

[Jadnashua]

Is your main shutoff a ball valve or a gate valve (or other, with a multi-turn handle)? It might not actually perfectly close.

 

[teqp]

Is your main shutoff a ball valve or a gate valve (or other, with a multi-turn handle)? It might not actually perfectly close.

It is a ball valve. I have turned it as much as possible to close it. Is there something I should do/look for to ensure it is fully closed?

Thanks

 

[Bluebinky]

Ok, so I shut off all toilet water lines and there was about a 0.004 cu ft increase at the main water line. This is equates to 0.03 gallons/ 2.5 hours.

Is this something that is normal or should I keep investigating? Thank you again for the replies.

Does this loss continue? It may be due to changes in main pressure or the water heater cooling off slightly or whatever.

 

[teqp]

Does this loss continue? It may be due to changes in main pressure or the water heater cooling off slightly or whatever.

After 3.5 hours it stayed the same. So I guess it was just equalizing? Thanks for the reply!

 

[Jadnashua]

SOme ball valves can be a bit stiff right at the end. The handle should reach a full 90-degrees from the pipe to ensure it is totally off and sealed.

 

[teqp]

SOme ball valves can be a bit stiff right at the end. The handle should reach a full 90-degrees from the pipe to ensure it is totally off and sealed.

Thanks, I'm certain that the valve is fully closed. I think since the water meter stays the same after haveing the small change on the meter is due to pressure equalizing. After a little more investigation, I believe it is the automatic shutoff valve or the check valve on the RO membrane.