Shut off valve under sink

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice' started by NVYNRSE, Feb 2, 2008.

  1. NVYNRSE

    NVYNRSE New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    Miami FL
    Earlier this week the guy we hired to make our cabinets came and installed the last cabinet. (after 8 months)
    The cabinet was the one under the sink so he removed the sink. In doing so left us with quite a mess. We're awaiting the counter top installation from someone else. He basically sawed off the PVC pipes to about 2 inches from the wall and removed all the connections to the copper pipes. So I have no sink, just bare pipes coming out of the wall until the counter top and sink arrive.
    The problem is this, the shut off valve is now leaking. I tried tightening the handle, no success. I tried tightening the hex nut, no success. I removed the hex nut and checked the washer and it looks ok (almost new, which leads me to believe it has been replaced recently). Any suggestions? I'm not a plumber and either is my husband. I have a picture of the valve and you can see where the water is dripping from if that helps.
  2. patrick88

    patrick88 Plumber

    Messages:
    836
    Location:
    Webster Ma.
    I would post the pic if you could.

    They do make really nice compression shut offs. That is if the pipes coming out of the wall are copper. If you end up replacing the valves I would go with 1/4 turn valves. !/4 turn valves have no rubber in them.
  3. NVYNRSE

    NVYNRSE New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    Miami FL
    Thanks for the info. I have attached two photos. (I hope)

    Attached Files:

  4. The reason that there are two discharge outlets on the leaking pipe on the left, is that it is the hot water line, and one 3/8" connection is for the sink faucet and other is for the dishwasher supply (hot water only). The one on the right of course has a single discharge connection for the sink cold water.
    If it were me (and as Patrick88 has already suggested), I would sand the copper line bright behind those existing fittings, turn the main water supply OFF, cut the lines halfway between the wall and the old shut-offs with a tubing cutter, and install new 1/2" compression fitting 1/4-turn ball valves, then you can use the old fittings for the 3/8" sink and dw connections, and have new easy-to-operate shut-offs. Use a back-up wrench on the ball valves when tightening the compression nuts. The brass ferrule ring is what seals a compression fitting, not the threads, so if you have a monor leak after tightening them, smear a little clear silicone caulk or pipe compound on the ring or wrap a wrap of teflon tape around it. Good luck!
    Problems solved.
    Mike
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2008
  5. patrick88

    patrick88 Plumber

    Messages:
    836
    Location:
    Webster Ma.
    Yup what he said. You could use a hack saw but you would need to file the sharp edges off the pipe before you continue.
  6. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,450
    Location:
    Connecticut
    Another option would be to shut off the water, cut off the 2 valves, and put on 2 sharkbite end caps, then restore the water.

    I would also recommend either putting a test plug, or, putting a jiffy cap on those 2 drain pipes as well. Them being open is allowing sewer gases to enter your home.

    It looks like you will be needing a plumber after the counter to install the sink drains and faucet anyway so just have him replace the stop valves then. I would go with separate valves for the sink and dishwasher.

    Sharkbites are available at Home Depot and plumbing supply houses. http://www.cashacme.com/prod_sharkbite_pushfit.php
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2008
  7. Raucina

    Raucina Previous member

    Messages:
    515
    What you need is a real cabinetmaker. Installing a cabinet 8 months late UNDER an existing sink? Hello!

    Einstein cabinet guy needed to leave the back off the unit and not disturb your plumbing. Use his money for the plumber and new valves.
  8. NVYNRSE

    NVYNRSE New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    Miami FL
    Thank you all so much! This is all good info to have. I'm writing everything down and will make sure it is done right. I am so appreciative.
    Yeah, I agree 100% with your opinion on the cabinets. You have no idea...
    Due to short fuse orders, we had 2 days to find a place to live down here and we more or less inherited a condo full of problems.
    We're military so thankfully, won't be here forever. The cabinet guy doesn't speak much english and was recommended by someone we thought was reliable. The lessons we learn in life... you get what you pay for and less.
    I don't know anything about plumbing but common sense tells me to leave the back of a "wood" cabinet open.
    Will this type of work be very expensive? Should I purchase all these things and the faucets, PVC etc. and have it here for the plumber?
  9. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,450
    Location:
    Connecticut
    I would pick out the big ticket stuff like sink, faucet, disposer and leave the small stuff to the plumber. Its hard to say exactly what is needed until its all going together.

    BTW stick to the big name makers for faucets Moen & Delta... There is a lot of junk out there!

    If you select an extra deep sink the drain in the wall may require reworking. Contact the plumber before the cabinet is mounted if you are doing that.
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2008
  10. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,313
    Location:
    New England
    As noted, the easiest thing would be to use some Sharkbite end caps. I'd pic up a tubing cutter (looks sort of like a C-clamp), cut as close to the existing valves, clean them off, then just slide the caps on. The plumber can cut them off more once he gets ready to install the new shutoffs and the rest of the plumbing. You can buy a compression valve that has multiple outlets and shutoffs. The only thing with a compression valve is to clean the pipe off and use two wrenches - one to hold the valve and the other to tighten the compression nut. A little oil or plumbers grease on the threads may make that final 1/4-turn easier and smoother.
  11. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    27,237
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    cabinets

    ALL the better cabinets have backs on them. Leaving it off would not have eliminated your problem because any decent plumber would replace the valves anyway. Your problem is the way the valves are secured to the pipe, but since there is a long section available, you have room to cut them off and install the more common compression valves. If you have a leak on the compression joing, tighten it a bit more. Teflon tape will do nothing to seal it.
  12. Raucina

    Raucina Previous member

    Messages:
    515
    Operated a cabinet factory for 25 years. High end, low end, now we never put backs on sink bases, unless the customer needs to hide some wall damage - and INSISTS. These are custom units. Many pre-mades have backs mainly to aid in shipping integrity. I especially stopped using backs when it became apparent that they hide slow leaks that might get detected otherwise. The water runs down the wall behind the back and seeps deep into the structure. If you need to chop into the wall later to fix something, you don't have that MDF or plywood in your way.

    I would pull the back off my high end cabinets prior to installation.

    My main point: if this guys Cabinetmaker had installed around the existing pipes, then the homeowner could have rehooked the supplies temporarily until a real plumber came around to swap the old valves.
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