Should I Buy a House with a Low-Yielding Well?

[mcbride4]

We are currently in negotiations to purchase a waterfront home. It was originally a cabin, built in 1946, and has had several remodels done since then. We recently had the well tested and discovered that it has a very low yield. The well inspector said that our area has an artesian well and 'unlimited water.' Apparently, the well is only 20 feet deep and the owner has just 'made do' with limited water by timing his activities and hooking up to his neighbor's well to water the lawn. We don't want to make a major purchase of a home with limited water. We have been told that we could get water storage tanks (I'm not sure where we would put them on the property since it does not have a covered garage and to place underground would be difficult since there is a septic and creek on the property). Another option is to drill a new well. I don't know how restrictive the county is on such things and if there is even a guarantee that the driller would have success. I guess my questions are: is a low-producing, shallow well in and of itself a deal killer? Can I assume that the yield will continue to drop if we experience drought conditions?How safe is it to assume that I can get a better water supply? Should I demand the seller resolve all issues before we proceed so I don't have to deal with the uncertainty? We love everything about this property and are excited to move forward, but not if this is going to be a major headache. Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[Reach4]

A new well near a fresh water lake would probably not have to be so deep. Would $10,000 for a new well and other stuff be a deal killer? Even if plenty of water was guaranteed, hypothetically? I am not a pro and I don't sell anything.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[mcbride4]

A new well near a fresh water leak would probably not have to be so deep. Would $10,000 for a new well and other stuff be a deal killer? Even if plenty of water was guaranteed, hypothetically? I am not a pro and I don't sell anything.

Actually, the home is on Puget Sound (saltwater) if that makes a difference. If we could be guaranteed a fully functioning well for $10,000 that would be okay, but is it possible we could buy the home and not be able to have a good well? Also, someone quoted us $25,000 to $50,000 for a new well including pump, filtration, the works. Is that crazy?

 

[Craigpump]

A new well near a fresh water lake would probably not have to be so deep.

LOL

Come to CT and I'll show you wells that are 1000' deep within spitting distance of Lake Zoar.

 

[Craigpump]

Actually, the home is on Puget Sound (saltwater) if that makes a difference. If we could be guaranteed a fully functioning well for $10,000 that would be okay, but is it possible we could buy the home and not be able to have a good well? Also, someone quoted us $25,000 to $50,000 for a new well including pump, filtration, the works. Is that crazy?

No, that's not crazy at all.

Thats why you tell the seller to put in the well, pump and treatment system and then you'll sign a contract providing the well meets or exceeds state minimum for yield and a proven water quality analysis by a state certified lab with chains of custody for the water...

There is no reason for you to take on the burden and expense of getting the well drilled and the pump put in.

 

[Boycedrilling]

You probably will not be able to get a loan with out a well that meets county minimum flow requirements. If you do buy it, you might not be able to sell it in the future.

Financial institutions don't want to have to drill a new well in case of repossession.

i would definitely make the purchase conditional upon a new well that meets standards for construction and flow. You can negotiate who pays the cost or a share of the cost. You might want to upgrade from the bare minimums.

You want a driller that is familiar with local conditions. Salt water intrusion is an issue in some areas. Go to www.wsgwa.org to find drillers that are members of our state groundwater association.

 

[ThirdGenPump]

A new well near a fresh water lake would probably not have to be so deep. Would $10,000 for a new well and other stuff be a deal killer? Even if plenty of water was guaranteed, hypothetically? I am not a pro and I don't sell anything.

In my experience we always have to drill deeper next lakes and ponds. The water is staying on the surface for a reason and isn't penetrating into the deeper aquifers.

Washington state has some really expensive wells do to their geology. If I were buying a home there I'd want to know it has a working well and let someone else take the risk associated with a new well..

 

[Ballvalve]

Everyone seems to have missed that he is on the ocean, not a lake. Slight difference. Rising sea levels and the tsunami issue in Washinton state would make me move inland and uphill. If you have a lender he will mind greatly if you are drinking surface water with a very low flow. As for a storage tank, you only need a 10' diameter footprint for several thousand gallons. You don't need to enclose it or bury it.

 

[MI Well Drilling]

We are currently in negotiations to purchase a waterfront home. It was originally a cabin, built in 1946, and has had several remodels done since then. We recently had the well tested and discovered that it has a very low yield. The well inspector said that our area has an artesian well and 'unlimited water.' Apparently, the well is only 20 feet deep and the owner has just 'made do' with limited water by timing his activities and hooking up to his neighbor's well to water the lawn. We don't want to make a major purchase of a home with limited water. We have been told that we could get water storage tanks (I'm not sure where we would put them on the property since it does not have a covered garage and to place underground would be difficult since there is a septic and creek on the property). Another option is to drill a new well. I don't know how restrictive the county is on such things and if there is even a guarantee that the driller would have success. I guess my questions are: is a low-producing, shallow well in and of itself a deal killer? Can I assume that the yield will continue to drop if we experience drought conditions?How safe is it to assume that I can get a better water supply? Should I demand the seller resolve all issues before we proceed so I don't have to deal with the uncertainty? We love everything about this property and are excited to move forward, but not if this is going to be a major headache. Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[mcbride4]

Everyone seems to have missed that he is on the ocean, not a lake. Slight difference. Rising sea levels and the tsunami issue in Washinton state would make me move inland and uphill. If you have a lender he will mind greatly if you are drinking surface water with a very low flow. As for a storage tank, you only need a 10' diameter footprint for several thousand gallons. You don't need to enclose it or bury it.

Thanks for all of the responses. Yes, it is near salt water--thanks for the clarification. Here are the latest updates: one driller came out and said that it is not possible to drill a new well, given the constrictions of the site. I have also found out the output is about 1 gallon per minute and has been pretty consistent for many years. We could put in a storage tank, but don't know if we're just gambling that the water stays consistent. What happens if our well runs dry and we are not able to drill a new well? Is our house worth nothing? I understand that wells are never a certainty, but is this a gamble worth taking, or not (I know the answer to this is just opinion...)? The house is NOT inexpensive--

 

[Valveman]

1 GPM is 1440 gallons per day. With enough storage, most houses could get by with 1/4 GPM from the well, but that is getting pretty critical. I know people who have to haul water in, others use rain catchment, and some even use a condensation unit. But water is critical. Even a mansion is worthless if there is no water.

 

[mcbride4]

1 GPM is 1440 gallons per day. With enough storage, most houses could get by with 1/4 GPM from the well, but that is getting pretty critical. I know people who have to haul water in, others use rain catchment, and some even use a condensation unit. But water is critical. Even a mansion is worthless if there is no water.

Update: we had the well production tested and it came to less than a gallon per minute. The owner of the home doesn't know if output has changed over the years--he's just "lived with it" and learned to time his water usage. It is unclear how deep the well is--the well inspector cannot see the depths because of the layout of the pump, etc. ? We had a drilling company come out and they said that we would have to hire someone with a cable rig to drill a new well since the site is tight and has limited space. Apparently, cable rigs are getting harder to find as most drillers are moving to the larger and faster equipment.
So...we would love to move forward on the property, but have some concerns about the water situation. Our options appear to be:
1) Install storage cisterns. This may be a good option, but I don't know if the well is going dry and if so, will we have difficulty finding a cable rig driller in the future when we need one?
2) Have the seller drill a new well before we proceed so we can assess output and water quality before signing on the line. This is my preferred plan, but the owner is 80+ years old and the realtor feels he won't want to do this.
3) Have the owner give us a substantial discount on the asking price and we navigate this on our own. I don't want to gouge him, but all of the risk would be on us if we took this route. There appears to be decent water in the area, but obviously, there are no guarantees in the drilling business. If a new well and equipment costs $20,000, maybe we ask for a $40,000 reduction?
4) Walk away from the deal.

Any thoughts?

 

[Reach4]

Any thoughts?

I think you have summarized nicely, although I guess the access problem seems a bit odd. Are you thinking that the government would charge you a lot to allow you to take down a few trees, or what? Could a driller drill with a rotary drill right next to the driveway?

If you got word that the house got sold to somebody else at 98% of asked, would you feel relieved that this burden has been lifted? If the house had a 20 GPM well, do you think that would have affected the asking price?

 

[Craigpump]

Having run into this scenario countless times over the years........ I'd have the seller drill you a well & put the pump in. Put the burden on him. If he won't do it get a lot of money put into an escrow account to cover the cost of the well & pump.

Storage tanks around here are a huge red flag, people see them and run to their car.
What if you don't make a well?
What if you "live with it" but want to sell after a few years? Those buyers will most likely make the same request as you.
What if you get a 20k price break, but the well costs 30k+?
Around here cable tool drillers are almost twice th money per foot as top head rotary drillers.

 

[Reach4]

Around here cable tool drillers are almost twice th money per foot as top head rotary drillers.

Why would customers find cable drilling to be worth a premium?

Edit: http://jwpwelldriller.com/Cable_Drilling_Advantage.html

http://waterfinder.ca/cable-tool-drilling/ seems to say that cable drilling would often/usually involve putting down casing at the same time. It talks about strong casing, so that would seem to imply steel vs PVC.

I did not find comments that cable drilling required less access or space. I even ran across this picture

on http://waterfinder.ca/cable-tool-drilling/

And if worst came to worst, how about a whole house desalination system combined with natural landscaping that does not need watering?

 

[mcbride4]

I think you have summarized nicely, although I guess the access problem seems a bit odd. Are you thinking that the government would charge you a lot to allow you to take down a few trees, or what? Could a driller drill with a rotary drill right next to the driveway?

If you got word that the house got sold to somebody else at 98% of asked, would you feel relieved that this burden has been lifted? If the house had a 20 GPM well, do you think that would have affected the asking price?

In terms of access, what I've been told is that the "regular drillers" need to have two large vehicles parked side by side--the lot is 3/4 of an acre, but has a large house, cottage, septic, narrow driveway and creek...all supposed issues in terms of having access.

Good question about how I would feel if it sold to someone else for 98% of asking price...I probably would feel like they have a potential risk on their hands. I would be happy to move forward even if the gpm was 5 or 6---that seems doable. Less than 1 gpm just really seems like an issue. Thanks so much for your insights.

 

[mcbride4]

Having run into this scenario countless times over the years........ I'd have the seller drill you a well & put the pump in. Put the burden on him. If he won't do it get a lot of money put into an escrow account to cover the cost of the well & pump.

Storage tanks around here are a huge red flag, people see them and run to their car.
What if you don't make a well?
What if you "live with it" but want to sell after a few years? Those buyers will most likely make the same request as you.
What if you get a 20k price break, but the well costs 30k+?
Around here cable tool drillers are almost twice th money per foot as top head rotary drillers.

So interesting that you say people "run to their cars" when they see storage tanks. That's my gut level too--it shows that there is an issue with the water. However, the realtor and some of the drilling/water companies say that it is NO BIG DEAL. I'd be interested in other people's thoughts. Also, with only 1 gpm, it still seems like it could be an issue to keep the storage tanks full with 4-5 people using water every day. I'm happy to conserve, but don't want to conserve out of fear that I'm going to run out of water!

 

[mcbride4]

Why would customers find cable drilling to be worth a premium?

Edit: http://jwpwelldriller.com/Cable_Drilling_Advantage.html

http://waterfinder.ca/cable-tool-drilling/ seems to say that cable drilling would often/usually involve putting down casing at the same time. It talks about strong casing, so that would seem to imply steel vs PVC.

I did not find comments that cable drilling required less access or space. I even ran across this picture

on http://waterfinder.ca/cable-tool-drilling/

And if worst came to worst, how about a whole house desalination system combined with natural landscaping that does not need watering?

Thanks for the information. I agree that natural landscaping would be a good option. I'm still just concerned about buying a relatively expensive waterfront property that has minimal water. As another person mentioned, when I want to sell the house, am I going to run into issues with buyers who want a new well?

 

[Reach4]

0.5 GPM is 720 gallons per day. 60 gallons per day is fairly typical per-person per-day water use, excluding irrigation.

I don't know about resale values. I would look at Zillow and try to see how the property pricing compares to other nearby properties. I understand that is imperfect.

 

[Craigpump]

0.5 GPM is 720 gallons per day. 60 gallons per day is fairly typical per-person per-day water use, excluding irrigation.

Theoretically, that sounds good, but what about those pesky peak demand times, showering after dinner, getting kids ready for bed, getting ready for school or work?

No surprise that one person wouldn't have any trouble, but you said he learned to live with it. Are you willing to learn to live with it like he did?