Restaurant plumbing corrections

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by spconstruction, Dec 19, 2013.

  1. spconstruction

    spconstruction In the Trades

    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    San Diego
    Hey everyone, new to the Forum. Did a lot of reading and research before i got Into doing a huge plumbing Job for a Restaurant. I Need advice on a 2 corrections before i can pass my inspections. First One is at the end of the line for the floor sink. Is this acceptable. I had a double fixture fitting and vented. It didnt pass. So i cut the concrete some more and plumb it how u See it now. Second is my drain for a Hand wash sink in the kitchen. I had to 45 my connections because of the supply in the way. It would be pushing out, and Not be inside the wall. All advice and help would be appreciated.

    Attached Files:

  2. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,064
    Location:
    Maine
    Are you a licensed plumber, or a contractor doing a commercial job without a license? I ask because if you had a license you wouldn't be asking the question and if you're not a licensed plumber you shouldn't be doing the work.
  3. spconstruction

    spconstruction In the Trades

    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    San Diego
    No i am Not licensed. I am working with the owner. I am Learning the plumbing trade, reviewed the codes and assist with the project. Asking for advice, or help. Some of these Codes are gray to me. Just looking for assistance.
  4. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,308
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    Excuse me for butting in, but although I'm a lowly DIY, I have picked up a fair amount of information over my tenure here. I am quite certain that commercial establishments can not use unlicensed plumbers. A GC plus an owner does not equal a license. You seem to be operating in California which is well know for stacks of rules of their own in addition to standard codes. I think you are on shaky ground here.
  5. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,270
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    1. An owner cannot do plumbing in a commercial establishment, only a single family residence.
    2. Even if he could, HE would have to do the work himself. He CANNOT hire "helpers" to do it for him.
    3. From what you show, I cannot tell how you could have had a "back to back fixture fitting" there.
    4. A "double Y" should have worked.
    5. I do not know why you HAD to 45 the drain line, since it still had to cross the water line.
  6. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,064
    Location:
    Maine
    Very shaky ground indeed and.... It pisses me off. You don't see plumbers jacking work from electricians, masons, carpenters, roofers etc but for some reason every handy hack contractor in the world seems to feel its his right to screw the plumbers over. If I knew where he was and where he was working, I'd turn him in.
  7. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,064
    Location:
    Maine
    Where's the vent?
  8. spconstruction

    spconstruction In the Trades

    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    San Diego
    Thanks! But i passed 80 percent of my Underground inspections. Did everything to Code and the inspector was really impressed. 4 floor sinks, 1 floor drain, all passed and tested in the kitchen. Not a DIYer. No disrespect to anyone here. And yes here when you file for owner builder, you can hire anyone to perform the work. Its upon there discretion. It states that on the application. Im jacking no work from anyone. Im out here looking for work and getting it. Like i said Im Learning the trade, because i want too. Not just for the heck of it. And i Seen worse work from licensed people, fly by night contractors and more. We got permits and plans.


    I dont have back to back fittings there. P trap, trap arm, wye rolled up for that fixture to be vented.
    I 45 that Hand sink because the fittings would be pushing out the drywall.
  9. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,064
    Location:
    Maine
    In my state you would be before a judge. Learning the trade my ass. You are jacking work from licensed plumbers and bypassing the proper channels. Where's the master you are working under and where is your apprentice card? How about the classroom hours too? You are learning the trade by asking questions on the Internet? That your inspector is an idiot is just lucky for you I guess. The vents wouldn't pass by any inspector that knew what he was doing. And what in hell is passed 80%
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2013
  10. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,270
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    IF you are not "jacking work" from a registered contractor, then you must be charging the same amount he would have, so how is the guy saving money?I am sure you are "working for wages" and a very low wage at that. The first thing our inspectors ask for is the contractor's license. In fact, you do not even get a permit without it, unless you are a homeowner doing it yourself. As for the owner, I am sure he is also getting other DIYs/sidejobbers/Tinkerjacklegs to do his electrical and other work. Did the inspector make you do a water test on the drainage, since your photos do not show any "test plugs" in the floor sink? Interesting that you could insert a 45 into a rolled up Y and make a 90 degree corner, since that should only be possible if the Y in horizontal. It takes a different fitting to make a 90 turn into a rolled up Y.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2013
  11. dj2

    dj2 Member

    Messages:
    399
    Location:
    California
    I don't think we know all the facts here, and therefore we should not pass any judgments. Not on this guy (owner builder?), the inspector (never call an inspector "idiot"), the whole system.

    When applying for a building permit here in CA, certain trades must be listed as a pre-requisite with license numbers (plumbing included). The fact that the inspector conducted an inspection means that these requirements were somehow met, which allowed such an inspection.

    Things are different in New England states and that's why living conditions are so great over there. We all know that. But to rant and make assumptions on a job 3000 miles away, without knowing all the facts is stupid.

    I'm not defending the OP, but Tom, cool down.
  12. spconstruction

    spconstruction In the Trades

    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    San Diego
    Thanks, once again and no disrespect to anyone here.
  13. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,064
    Location:
    Maine
    Your code is slightly different as are the procedures for procuring a plumbing license but they are not that different. The guy is plumbing illegally and either the inspector is an idiot, getting paid off or is a relative.

    California Code of Regulations
    Title 16, Division 8, Article 3. Classifications

    A plumbing contractor provides a means for a supply of safe water, ample in volume and of suitable temperature for the purpose intended and the proper disposal of fluid waste from the premises in all structures and fixed works. This classification includes but is not limited to:

    (a) Complete removal of waste from the premises or the construction and connection of on-site waste disposal systems;

    (b) Piping, storage tanks and venting for a safe and adequate supply of gases and liquids for any purpose, including vacuum, compressed air and gases for medical, dental, commercial and industrial uses;

    (c) All gas appliances, flues and gas connections for all systems including suspended space heating units. This does not include forced warm air units;

    (d) Water and gas piping from the property owner's side of the utility meter to the structure or fixed works;

    (e) Installation of any type of equipment to heat water, or fluids, to a temperature suitable for the purposes listed in this section, including the installation of solar equipment for this purpose; and

    (f) The maintenance and replacement of all items described above and all health and safety devices such as, but not limited to, gas earthquake valves, gas control valves, back flow preventors, water conditioning equipment and regulating valves.

    Authority cited: Sections 7008 and 7059, Reference: Sections 7058 and 7059 (Business and Professions Code)

    How to go about getting a plumbing license in California:

    1 Graduate from high school or get a passing grade on the General Educational Development (GED) exam. Most apprenticeship programs require that you are 18 and have received the equivalent of a high school diploma.

    2 Apply for a state recognized plumbing apprenticeship program. These programs are available through organizations or plumbing companies. They usually include coursework and on-the-job training lasting up to 4 years.
    Go to the California Department of Industrial Relations website, at dir.ca.gov, to research potential apprenticeship programs in your county. Look under the "Apprenticeship" tab and search by occupation and county.
    You can also research a degree in plumbing from a technical school. This will cover a portion of your educational requirement and the program may be able to place you in an apprenticeship position.

    3 Complete all course work and work experience and pass all exams during your apprenticeship. These qualifications will allow you to work as a journeyman plumber.

    4 Work as a journeyman plumber for 4 years. You can complete jobs that are $500 or less without a contractor's license. You can also work for a plumbing company as a foreman, owner-builder or supervisor for that 4 year period.

    So at the end of section 4 that bit about jobs less than 500 dollars is probably where this is getting slid through but that only pertains to residential work and no sane plumber would do that work for that pay.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2013
  14. ImOld

    ImOld New Member

    Messages:
    73
    Location:
    In the rumble seat
    Tough crowd here today.

    Same rhetoric on the electrical forums.

    Mr Sawyer.

    You all have done many things that you were not licensed to do, qualified to do and without inspections.

    And please spare me the, as a homeowner I'm allowed to do anything I please, in my state, county, city.

    Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious person but there are so many great "gotcha's" in the Bible.:)
  15. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,064
    Location:
    Maine
    He's NOT the homeowner. He's an unlicensed contractor working in a commercial kitchen. And no, as the homeowner you are absolutely NOT allowed to do anything you please in your state, county, city. You ARE required to get a permit and you ARE required to have the work inspected throughout the various phases of construction and you ARE required to follow the state and local codes.
  16. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,780
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    When I travel to other countries, you know, the ones where you can't drink the water without getting sick, so therefore you need to take shots "before" you go, and they tell you don't drink from a bottle unless it top "pops" off. Don't drink from refilled bottles :(

    What makes this a first world country is licensing of certain fields.
    Plumbing is one, and that is so that we don't poison the community water supply, which has happened with restaurant plumbing. That is why it requires a commercial license to work on that plumbing. Four years under an apprenticship. At the end of four years, you can take the commercial test for plumbers. They don't view it as a learn as you go type of thing.
    It may be that the local inspector has no idea that the person doing the work is unlicensed. I rarely get asked for my card, even though I carry it in my wallet.
    Whenever I get back from traveling, I feel like kissing the ground here. It is so much cleaner and safer. And that takes cooperation, and laws, and people that follow laws.
    If you want to see what it's like to have the freedom to polute your neigbors water, just travel to those areas of the world. See it first hand. It will change the way you think.
    And by the way. The bible has plenty of "laws" mentioned in it. One is to treat your neighbor as you would want to be treated.
    In other words, don't mess with the water supply we all drink from. :)

    A picture showing more of the job would help. Seeing just a few fittings doesn't show much of the layout. :)

    This is true freedom. There are no electrical or plumbing laws here.

    [​IMG]

    Electrical wiring in India. They have more freedom there. Don't you wish the US had freedom like this to run wires anyway you like?
    But wait......we have lawyers here. We sue people that kill our kids by electrocuting them.

    [​IMG]

    A public sewer line and convenient bathroom. This is why most of the women have long dresses. They can squat over the ditch.

    [​IMG]

    A woman pumping water, just a few feet from the sewer ditch that people pee in.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2013
  17. ImOld

    ImOld New Member

    Messages:
    73
    Location:
    In the rumble seat
    I'm shocked I tell you...................shocked.

    That's two people that chose to read and edit my post as a means to their spin.

    Do I need to use this as a means of a getting your attention?

    It's your "Holier than thou" attitude.

    In other words, you need an attitude adjustment.

    Remember, there are Federal laws covering verbal abuse of old prople.:p
  18. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,780
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I'm sorry to be so mean to you.
    I will take up my bible today and be gooder.

    When I was in India, I enjoyed going to all the religious sites. Pretty cool.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2013
  19. ImOld

    ImOld New Member

    Messages:
    73
    Location:
    In the rumble seat
    How long does it take a plumber to put in a P trap?

    First you have to teach them the alphabet. :p;):D:)
  20. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,064
    Location:
    Maine
    "If I had my life to live over again, I'd be a plumber". Albert Einstein
Similar Threads: Restaurant plumbing
Forum Title Date
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & Commercial Plumbing (Restaurant) repair problem--hot water coming out ice and urinal Dec 3, 2010
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & restaurant grease trap install? Feb 3, 2010
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & Plumb Old Airstream as Restaurant..Help! Dec 13, 2009
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & Sewer gas in brand new restaurant Jan 24, 2006
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & Plumbing waste and vent layout for new construction Jul 18, 2014

Share This Page