Recommendation advice

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by guinaevere, Feb 4, 2014.

  1. guinaevere

    guinaevere New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    ga
    Reading the reviews here, and at CR have been very helpful. But now I need help narrowing down the field.

    Drake, Drake II, Ultramax, Ultramax II, Cadet (3? I lost my little notepad), or Cimarron

    Of all the better affordable models, which can reliably move the most solids without clogging? I am a caretaker for someone who frequently clogs almost any toilet he uses.

    Another big concern came up reading that some of the newer models have mouths which typical plungers will not work for. So in addition to the above request for which model would suit him best, what plunger should we have on hand for when it does inevitably clog?

    Any input would be appreciated.
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 4, 2014
  2. queen50

    queen50 New Member

    Messages:
    29
    Location:
    Washington state
    I'm not an expert, just a consumer, but I'm fond of the American Standard Champion 4. We have 3, two elongated 'comfort height', and one regular round front. Two of them have been in for 4 years with never a clog. The only thing we've replaced is the handle on one of them.

    The third one went in last spring in our new basement bathroom.
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2014
  3. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Messages:
    1,760
    Location:
    New York, NY
    The Toto Drake will flush as well as the Champion 4, and uses industry-standard parts (unlike the Champion) so when something needs to be replaced, you can get the part at the local hardware store. Also, the Toto has excellent build quality, so the chances of getting a defective one are much lower. The Drake II has a little better bowl wash.

    No plunger makes a complete seal over the "hole" (it's really a passageway/baffle) at the bottom of the bowl; a plunger with the extra stuff at the end like this one will work fine: http://www.lowes.com/pd_135360-319-...l=1&currentURL=?Ntt=toilet+plunger&facetInfo=

    Any plunger with that general shape at the head works well. I have a Clorox one (I know, weird, right?) that has a nice holder and a handle like on a snowshovel at the end, is made of good material, and is easy to use because of the handle. It has that same head design so it works great. Korky also makes several good ones that all have the same kind of head design. http://korky.com/plungers.html

    The key is to use Terry's method of plunging. You don't try to dislodge the clog with one big push. Instead, you put the plunger in, and make numerous short, quick, strokes up and down until you see the water vibrate and feel a little suction on the plunger, then remove and voila! it will all go down. The hole at the bottom of the toilet is larger than the trapway through which the stuff runs, so you're really just trying to get the clog to move around a bit so the water can carry it down the trapway and out of the toilet and down the (larger) drain pipe that the toilet connects to at the floor.
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2014
  4. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,298
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    Toto toilets are quite popular with users of this forum. American Standard has quality control issues and many forum rats opine that AS dumps factory seconds on discount house. Many pro plumbers (not all) on the forum will not install AS because the find too many have to be returned which wastes time. When AS does not have a problem, they work well. I have 2 Toto toilets in my home and have had zero problems, There have been very few Toto buyers that have reported any kind of problem on the forum. Most of us don't even own a plunger. As with any toilet of any manufacturer, you should only flush materials that toilets are intended to flush iehuman waste and toilet paper.
  5. guinaevere

    guinaevere New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    ga
    Thank you all for the input. It's been of great assistance.
  6. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Messages:
    1,760
    Location:
    New York, NY
    Our pleasure. One other thought, if you're still reading this thread, is that if the person you are taking care of is older, he may appreciate a toilet that sits at "ADA" or "Universal" height, which is easier on the knees.

    The original Toto Drake is available in an ADA-height bowl, but you have to ask for it and it costs a little more.

    The Toto Drake II comes standard with a Universal Height bowl (as does the Ultramax II). All three are excellent toilets, and the Drake II is an excellent value with what you get. However, if the person is budget-conscious, the original Drake is a little less expensive.
  7. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,802
    Location:
    New England
    There's a small portion of the population that has a medical problem and produces either really long and/or hard stools. For those people, the best line may be the Caromas which have the largest trapway of any readily available. Another possibility, while I personally don't like pressure assist toilets, those sometimes are a good choice because they can break apart some stools a gravity flush can't. That doesn't always work as well as the larger trapway of the Caroma series.
  8. guinaevere

    guinaevere New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    ga
    I think we're leaning towards the Drake II. I've found a local dealer who has different models available, but I'm not entirely sure what the differences are. One is pictured without a seat, but I don't know if that's the ONLY difference?

    Toto Drake CST454CEFG

    Toto Drake CST454CUFG
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 10, 2014
  9. Reach4

    Reach4 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,885
    Location:
    IL
    toto-drake-elongated-2-piece-toilet-cst454cefg-01-cotton-white/p20690
    handle on left. 1.28 GPF

    toto-drake-elongated-2-piece-toilet-cst454cufg-01-cotton-white/p312343
    Flush handle on left 1 gallon flush

    toto-drake-elongated-2-piece-toilet-cst454cufrg-01-cotton-white/p312344
    Flush handle on right when facing tank. 1 gal flush

    See http://www.terrylove.com/forums/showthread.php?52238-Toto-Drake-II-confusion
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 10, 2014
  10. guinaevere

    guinaevere New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    ga
    Thank you SO much! With it being a gravity flush I prefer more water, so it'll be the 1.28 gallon (though I wish it were more).
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 16, 2014
  11. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Messages:
    1,760
    Location:
    New York, NY
    Well, you're in Georgia, and Toto is in Morrow. However, that's the factory.

    My advice to you is that you can often get close to the online price, with good service, from a local plumbing supply house. Determine the model number and color that you want. (Two-piece Totos come without a seat, one-piece Totos come with a seat. The Toto seat SS114 is nice.) Open the Yellow Pages. Go to plumbing supply. Whether or not they say they carry Toto, they can likely get it from their wholesaler. Call at least five supply houses. I'm serious. At least 5. Ask for a price quote on your specific model and color, and let them know that you're ready to buy today if the price is right. Use Terry's prices above as a guide to a fair price. You will find that the prices vary wildly. You should find at least one that has a fair price, and at least one that has a crazy-high price. At least one will be super-friendly and nice. At least one will be pricks. That's just the way it goes. Among those, you should find one that you would like to do business with.

    I have proposed this methodology for months on this site, and those who follow it report back that they are happy with the results. I have been surprised at how good the prices and service have been that have been reported to us. Let us know how it goes.

    If you want the Drake II 1.28gpf toilet, the model is CST454CEFG, in cotton white, it is Color #01.
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2014
  12. guinaevere

    guinaevere New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    ga
    You're wonderful.

    I have to shuffle some savings around, as I got blindsided a month ago when the heat went out and I had to have the entire house's hvac replaced. As soon as I have a few dollars into a liquid account, I'll do exactly as prescribed, being ready to buy on the spot for the right price.
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 16, 2014
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