Re-working Basement Fixture Drain System (WS, AN, RO, and WM)

Discussion in 'Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and r' started by ACEschborn, Dec 18, 2013.

  1. ACEschborn

    ACEschborn New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Hello All!

    I am looking to bring my basement fixtures' drain plumbing up to snuff. Long story short, things are not correct (happy to explain as needed). I want to make sure everything is safe (think: air gaps, p-traps, backup) and hopefully (but not necessarily) up to code (2003 IPC). The fixtures are a water softener, acid neutralizer, clothes washer, and reverse osmosis. The basement is not, and never will be finished.

    I’ve attached current and proposed drawings. There is one update to the proposed drawing that I did not re-draw: The proper double fitting should be a double fixture tee not a double san-tee.

    Questions/comments:

    • Air Gaps
      - On one of the 18†standpipes I’m planning to use THIS air gap, which will receive the reverse osmosis and water softener drainage
      - On the other 18†standpipe I’m planning to use THIS air gap, which will receive the acid neutralizer and clothes washer
      - Do these two air gaps look okay?
    • If I use 18†of standpipe, I will probably be up into the space between the joists; is this okay?
      - This would still be less than the max height (96â€) that the clothes washer can pump per the owner’s manual
    • Do all of the fittings, pipe sizes, and lengths look okay?
      - Can 2" pipe handle an acid neutralizer and washing machine? They will likely never run at the same time.
    • Do I understand correctly that the trap arm for the 2†standpipes must be greater than 4†(and less than some other number?)?
    • Do I need vents for the new 2†standpipes and traps? (this would be very difficult unless I used an AAP/tudor)
    • Am I missing anything? Anything else to consider?
    • Shouldn't the horizontal 4x3" san-tee actually be a wye + 45 or combination wye?

    Thanks in advance for your help!

    -ace
  2. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    You do no want to use any 3/8" connection for your water treatment equipment, it is too small for most softeners and any back washed filters.

    And if there has been no problem with draining any of those things, I'd find something else to 'fix'....
  3. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

    Messages:
    3,052
    Location:
    Maine
    I concur.

    Merry Christmas Gary.
  4. ACEschborn

    ACEschborn New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Hi guys, thank you for the replies Gary and Tom.

    Unfortunately, there are problems with the current setup. 1. the softener, for a reason beyond me (it was okay for years), has been overflowing the current standpipe, 2. there are no air-gaps, and 3. there are no traps.

    Gary, my plan was to use the 3/8" for the reverse osmosis discharge; is it not big enough? I believe the discharge line is 1/4".
  5. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    The 3/8" is fine for an RO. A backup means there is blockage in the drain system. That will not be cured by lengthening the standpipes or adding air gaps etc.. You should first check the DLFC button that it is installed correctly or not worn out/damaged. You might have a blocked standpipe trap for some reason. Or the connection of the trap to the sewer line pipe.

    As you say it has worked wel for years, so find the cause of it not working right before you change things and create another problem.

    Merry Christmas everyone.
  6. ACEschborn

    ACEschborn New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Merry Christmas to you too, Gary!

    The current standpipe is only 3/4" copper, and as such, I figured it wasn't properly sized. Wouldn't cleaning it out would only be a temporary fix? That is, isn't 3/4" too small for the WS discharge? I understand the air gaps will not prevent backups, but they will ensure my drinking water stays clean should any other problem arise. I have not inspected the DLFC button and will do so, thank you for that idea.
  7. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    The standard softener drain line is 5/8" OD. It is called 1/2" but the ID is not true 1/2" like 1/2" PE. So 3/4" copper tubing is more than enough. And you said things worked well for years, so it is not the drain line size, it means there is a blockage.

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