Question on 2" sewage check valve

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jasper1372

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We've lived in a couple homes with sewage ejector pumps in the basement which pump the basement sewage/grey water up about 5 or 6 feet into the septic system. In our first home, after about 6 years the check valve failed (wedged closed due to flap breaking off, flap was rubber with slightly smaller metal discs riveted to each side..... I'd have to believe was a faulty design that the metal discs weren't small enough to allow the flap to be pumped right through the pipe in case of this type of failure) and ended up breaking the schedule 40 pipe due to severe vibration of the pump attempting to pump but the line being blocked. Needless to say it was a bit of a mess in the basement to clean up.

So, that being said, we've since then replaced the check valves every 3 or 4 years or so.....certainly not wanting a repeat of the problem and since check valves are fairly cheap.....it just seems to make sense.

I've been doing to reading up on "check valves" recently since it's about time to replace..... and I'm wondering if anyone knows if there are more durable/reliable check valves available that might last longer ?

Anyone have any expertise on this ?

Thanks in advance to any advice anyone can give me.
 
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hj

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I am not sure what kind of check valves you have been using, but the ones designed for sewage pumps connect with rubber sleeves so they would NOT break the pipe even if they could get stuck closed. usually, we replace these only when we replace the pump.
 

jasper1372

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I understand you point jh.....if I hadn't seen it happen myself I would doubt it too. Since it was 10 or 12 years ago and in a different house, my memory is not as acute....but trust me, it did happen that way, complete with broken 2" schedule 40 pipe with jagged edges. Fortunately we were able to just saw the two remaining ends to a clean edge and glue in a section of new pipe, replace the check valve and be good as new....once we scrubbed down the area with bleach.

I'm just so afraid of it happening again I'm not going to chance letting another check valve go more than 4 or 5 years without replaceing. The last one I replaced (about 3 years ago) which the plumber had installed when we built our new home 8 years ago, actually had a flap without the metal discs on each side and the flap was slightly curled and not stopping the water from back flowing...which is what drew my attention to replacing it. It's not all that difficult a job as you know....so cheap insurance I guess.

However....what do you think about installing a 2" ball valve (with full clearance inside the pipe) right above the check valve to make it even easier to replace ? Would that be a good idea ?
 
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Ballvalve

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Ballvalve yes. If you use a zoeller check the rubber flaps are replaceable and cheap. No need to toss the whole thing. Myself, I use a 3" ball check that has never clogged or failed in 10 years.

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/ZOELLER-Full-Flow-Check-Valve-2P844?Pid=search

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/ZO...cm_sp=IO-_-IDP-_-RR_VTV70300505&cm_vc=IDPRRZ1

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/ch...atalog/N-ac0Z1z0o3qiZ1z13mnw/Ntt-check+valves a little pricy....

And here is a USA ball valve thats only a few bucks more than most of the chinese junk that will not close after a few years; its only 19 bucks.

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/KBI-Ball-Valve-3TFG4?Pid=search

Now, just to show you how easy it is to save jobs and the American industry, here is the CHINESE crap "equivilent" for 5 US dolla more. Stupid Amelicans! We makka you into Bulgar king world only. Then we land in Los Angeles! Then you no pump your poopoo, you cally it in buckets to Bok-choy fields!

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/Ball-Valve-6AJX3?cm_sp=IO-_-IDP-_-RR_VTV70300505&cm_vc=IDPRRZ1
 
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Hackney plumbing

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We've lived in a couple homes with sewage ejector pumps in the basement which pump the basement sewage/grey water up about 5 or 6 feet into the septic system. In our first home, after about 6 years the check valve failed (wedged closed due to flap breaking off, flap was rubber with slightly smaller metal discs rivited to each side..... I'd have to believe was a faulty design that the metal discs weren't small enough to allow the flap to be pumped right through the pipe in case of this type of failure) and ended up breaking the schedule 40 pipe due to severe vibration of the pump attempting to pump but the line being blocked. Needless to say it was a bit of a mess in the basement to clean up.

So, that being said, we've since then replaced the check valves every 3 or 4 years or so.....certainly not wanting a repeat of the problem and since check valves are fairly cheap.....it just seems to make sense.

I've been doing to reading up on "check valves" recently since it's about time to replace..... and I'm wondering if anyone knows if there are more durable/reliable check valves available that might last longer ?

Anyone have any expertise on this ?

Thanks in advance to any advice anyone can give me.

Just curious,what would happen if the downstairs toilets flapper or ballcock failed and water continued to flow to the pump and the pump continued to cycle pumping out the basin to the septic tank. After a while the septic tank would fill. The basement seweage pump would continue to pump to a full septic tank. Would it then pump sewage into the bathrooms of the upstairs?
 

Ballvalve

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How can a pump pump backwards through it self?

It would dead head, or saturate the leach field until the water found a gopher hole and then the water would come up in the neighbors yard.
 

Hackney plumbing

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How can a pump pump backwards through it self?

It would dead head, or saturate the leach field until the water found a gopher hole and then the water would come up in the neighbors yard.


I understood it to be the basement has a pump.....the rest of the house is gravity to the septic tank.

I would say the water would take the path of least resistance be it to the neighbors yard or maybe back into the house if theres no protection.
 

Ballvalve

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Couldnt make it back in the house because there is a check valve. Pump would just spin until it shut off on thermal, if any.
 

Ballvalve

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Don't need to install THAT sump pump to know how it works. Well, the only other scenario is that after the leach field fills, the pump [as I mentioned] would dead-head [not move water]. Then the basement would be the leach field.

If it has a thermal cut-out, it would cycle on and off. If not, it would typically burn up.
 

Hackney plumbing

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Don't need to install THAT sump pump to know how it works. Well, the only other scenario is that after the leach field fills, the pump [as I mentioned] would dead-head [not move water]. Then the basement would be the leach field.

If it has a thermal cut-out, it would cycle on and off. If not, it would typically burn up.

Knowing how the sump pump works has nothing to do with the rest of the home thats gravity drained to a septic tank. The only thing that would for sure protect his house would be a relief overflow drain. This would prevent the pump from flooding the house if the toilet hung up and filled the septic system.

Same thing for a house thats lower than the manhole cover serving that sewer on a gravity system. If the city sewer backs up and your lower than the manhole then your house is about to be flooded with city raw sewage unless your protected.

Some use backwater valves. problem with using a backwater valve is they can fail and its a maintenance issue. I prefer the relief drain or a combination relief and backwater valve if a sewage overflow would be a danger to public health in that location.
 

Ballvalve

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He said its a sewage ejector pump, and everything is 6' up. No gravity flow anywhere except after [sort of] it gets above the lift level. His only option is a second pump perhaps with battery back up.
 

Hackney plumbing

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He said its a sewage ejector pump, and everything is 6' up. No gravity flow anywhere except after [sort of] it gets above the lift level. His only option is a second pump perhaps with battery back up.

Its not as clear as your making it out to be. I suspect the entire home does not flow to the sewage pump.......only the basement does. The upper level is connected to the septic system by gravity flow.

Maybe the O.P. can clear that up.

After reading it again.....the O.P. says the sewage ejector pumps the BASEMENT SEWAGE/GREY WATER. To me that doesn't include the rest of the home.
 
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Ballvalve

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Don't need to install THAT sump pump to know how it works. Well, the only other scenario is that after the leach field fills, the pump [as I mentioned] would dead-head [not move water]. Then the basement would be the leach field.

If it has a thermal cut-out, it would cycle on and off. If not, it would typically burn up.

Fine, its still the same answer. The basement would fill with crap after the field was saturated, and then the upstairs toilets would back up too.
 

Hackney plumbing

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Fine, its still the same answer. The basement would fill with crap after the field was saturated, and then the upstairs toilets would back up too.

Why would the basement fill up? It has a pump with a check valve. I suppose it would come through the upstairs finished floor after the pump flooded the upstairs if gravity line is not protected.


This is really simple. If the septic system fills with water and the downstairs toilet malfunctioned and keeps delivering water to the sewage pump.....the pump can not determine if the septic system is full or not. Its job is to pump the water out to where ever it can.

The sewage pump would continue to pump and since the septic system is full the only place for it to go may be the upstairs and flood the place.

Provided no protection was given to the gravity system against such an incident.
 
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