Problem Installing Toto Aquia on Closet Flange on Floor

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by herbolaryo, Jul 17, 2007.

  1. herbolaryo

    herbolaryo New Member

    Messages:
    31
    Location:
    San Francisco
    The clearance between the wall and the center of the toilet flange is 11 inches.

    The instruction on the Toto Aquia Manual says it should be 12 inches.

    Is there a way to move the toilet Flange 1 inch away from the wall?:confused:

    Complete Instructions for the Aquia written by Jamie
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 8, 2009
  2. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

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    I can only guess you had a 10" toilet prior to this one that had a 1" gap behind the tank.
    Unfortunately you'll either have to do the same, or go under the floor and cut in a coupling and cut the floor to get the flange away from the wall.
    I'm going to make a second guess....this is a bath remodel and someone thought a 12" rough was 12" away from the rough wall.
  3. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

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    14,890
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    With the Aquia, you will need about 11.5" from the finished wall.
    edited on 7/18/2007

    That means moving the drain, unless you have a 4" drain, and you can fake it over a bit.
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2009
  4. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

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    Pullleease don't tell me thats the actual rough!
    I'm going to guess you mean it can go as far as 11-1/2"...I just don't wanna think I'd have to look at toilet specs before roughing...no, say it ain't so.
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 8, 2009
  5. herbolaryo

    herbolaryo New Member

    Messages:
    31
    Location:
    San Francisco
    So that will mean it will be 12 1/2 inch from the wall.
    I guess that would be OK.
    Our dilemna is how to pull out the old flange.
    I saw this flange buster... http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...026&pr=goog-sl

    However it is available in 4 inch diameter. Ours is 3 inch.
    The toilet is in 2nd floor by the way.
    Any suggestion of removing the flange without tearing the ceiling underneath or a big portion of the floor making it unstable.
  6. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,890
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    A 12" rough-in is measured from the finished wall.
    That would mean, with 1/2" drywall, the rough would be 12.5" from the wood studs.
    The Aquia needs 11.75" from the finished wall to the center of the drain.
    Many toilets that are 12" rough, will work at 11", but not the Aquia.
  7. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

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    Oh great...lol...now I gotta start asking what kind of toilet's going in on remodels.
    I imagine it'd still work on an actual 12"....with it being 1/4" difference.
  8. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,892
    Location:
    New England
    Grumpy, the Aquia is a 12" rough toilet...this guy has 11". As with most toilets, there is normally a little gap behind the toilet, for this toilet, about 1/4"...it won't fit with 11"!
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2007
  9. GrumpyPlumber

    GrumpyPlumber Licensed Grump

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    Jim, I know that.
    When I rough a 12" I leave 12-3/4" to 13" from the stud to center of flange..but Terry posted this:
    It's only a 1/4" difference, but it's apparently not like other 12" roughs if thats the case.
    Getting knots just thinking about having to research each model before doing rough remodels or new construction.
    I prefer the tank to rest on the wall...minimizing movement and potential trouble later on.
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2007
  10. Tmylett

    Tmylett Junior Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    San Rafael, Ca.

    Hi Terry and other commode experts ...

    I am about to purchase an Aquia for a bathroom remodel and I am glad I found this forum. I have a rough in question. I now have an actual rough in of 11 3/4" from drywall(after adding a 1/2" sheerwall to the behind the toilet). I still have to plaster this wall as well ... 2 coats of veneer. So add probably atleast another 1/8".

    So at 11 5/8" is it a NO Go with the Aquia? Does base board effect the set back equasion as well .. do I add the thickness of the base to the finished wall ...since we are dealing with a skirt?


    Thanks
  11. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,890
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I think it will fit with 11-5/8"

    The tank fits close, the bowl has some room.
  12. Emma3

    Emma3 New Member

    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Washington
    Too much room for Aquia?

    I've got the opposite problem -- just had new rough-in for Aquia, plumber put it 14" O.C. from the stud. Will this put the tank far enough from the wall to cause any problem (or just look bad)? If so, I'd consider furring out the wall slightly before the sheetrock, but don't want to bother unless it's significant.

    Guess I'm glad it's not too close... that would be much worse.

    Also - I keep reading about how the Aquia install is difficult or more time consuming than other models. Does this apply to the final install only, or are there any "tricks" that apply to the rough-in stage?

    Thanks in advance!
    Andra
  13. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,892
    Location:
    New England
    There's probably 3/4" or so (you can check the spec sheets on the toto website) when installed with a 12" rough-in. So, you'll have two more inches. Whether you think it looks bad or not depends on the room. Keep in mind that that distance is from the FINISHED wall, not the studs.

    If the floor is going to be tiled, the plumber will need to drill some holes through the tile - some floor tile requires a diamond bit to do it. If he doesn't have one, he will complain, and it will take him longer. A normal toilet just gets attached to the flange. The aquia has an adapter bolted to the flange, then has the bracket attached to the floor. If it is on vinal or something like that, it should only take a little longer (except, he needs to actually read the instructions and measure, something some guys refuse to do!).
  14. Emma3

    Emma3 New Member

    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Washington
    Thanks, Jim. I think we'll close the gap a bit when it comes time to finish the wall. Anything > 2" seems really excessive.

    Drilling through the tile would happen at the same time as final install? After reading about the special sanding required for tank connection, I'm thinking of hiring someone with Aquia experience to do this part, so they would know to expect the drilling.

    Can't wait to finally have the Aquia ready to go -- I love our Pacifica, but would have gone with dual-flush had it been available at the time we did that bath.

    Thanks for the quick responses, as always!

    Andra

    [​IMG]
    TOTO Pacifica CST808
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 21, 2009
  15. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,892
    Location:
    New England
    Unless the plumber has installed one previously, he may not have a diamond core bit with him to drill the tile. While sanding isn't always necessary, it only take a moment, and just smooths the casting out a little making a better seal. It often will seal without it, but why do it twice if it doesn't?

    Some floor tile is VERY hard, so not so much. A diamond bit will cut anything, but a carbide one may only scratch the surface. So, having the right tool can mean the difference of an hour or more of cussing.

    The adapter and brackets go on after the finished floor is installed. You could install it and save the grief.
  16. Emma3

    Emma3 New Member

    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Washington
    I considered installing it ourselves (we installed the Pacifica, which required drilling into the concrete slab, and an unexpected and rather unattractive fix for the supply location), but frankly I was intimidated by the posts complaining of wrong drilling specs in the instructions, and of leaking tanks. I just want it to be right (ok, so I want it to be perfect), and I'm pretty sure the DIY job won't be. Is it not as bad as those stories make it seem?
  17. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,892
    Location:
    New England
    Toto gives you plastic inserts to use in the holes that you drill to hold the screws. Many have found that they are a little too large for the hole they tell you to drill. That's annoying. I think maybe they are metric, and chose the closest standard fractional drill bit, so they're a little tight to install easily. You can always substitute any other one that would fit the hole - they're cheap, or figure out what size hole they really need. Now, this may very well have changed...I haven't installed on for quite awhile.

    Have you got the unit at home? Take it out of the box, read the instructions, look at the parts, then decide. You can buy a diamond bit at Lowes for probably less than $20...cheaper than a plumber doing it. Depending on the tile, it might take you a couple of minutes per hole. Use a spray bottle and spritz the hole to keep the bit wet and do it slowly - let the diamonds grind the hole - it's not like a knife or a twist drill cutting through wood. Do a practice hole in a spare piece of tile. It helps to put a piece of tape on the floor where you are going to drill.

    If you've never used a diamond core bit, you really need a variable speed drill. If you have something with a same sized hole in it, you can place it over the spot where you want to drill the hole, kneel on it, then use it as a guide to get the hole started. If you don't do that, it's a little trickier...the thing doesn't have a center - it is like a pipe with diamonds on the rim, so getting started takes some knowledge. You hold the drill at an angle, around 45-degrees works, and use the edge to score and start the hole. Then, once you get a little divot, you gradually rotate the drill so it is vertical. If you do it slowly and smoothly, you'll get a nice hole exactly where you want. The tape helps grab things and to protect around the tile in case it wanders. Once you do one, it's a piece of cake, especially on a floor...it's harder to hold it exactly where you want on a wall.
  18. Emma3

    Emma3 New Member

    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Washington
    This is all starting to sound very familiar... Yep - I recall having to redrill the holes, and no, I didn't have a diamond bit (*&%@#!).

    If drilling the holes is the only tricky part, I'll definitely go for it myself. But this is required for all Toto toilets, no? If so, then what makes the Aquia so much more time consuming to install?

    The post that had me concerned dealt with leaks between the tank and bowl, so I thought maybe that was the issue.

    Andra
  19. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,892
    Location:
    New England
    Just measure carefully. The plastic anchors will go in, but you'll need a hammer. If you don't want to get that radical, buy some other ones.
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