OOPS! Yeah, I dropped it (?'s on placing deep well jet around it.

Discussion in 'Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog' started by Dropper, Nov 8, 2012.

  1. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    My 4" submersible pump froze up and being on low income, all I could find were very expensive replacements or replacements for a couple hundred dollars that I was afraid were too cheap/wouldn't last, compared to th 5 and $600 models. I can only hope I was right about that.

    So, downgraded to an above ground 3/4 hp deep well jet pump with the 1" and 1 1/4" ridged pipe ( I used the existing 1" and ran a new 1" 1/4" along side for a 2 pipe deep well jet system. Working by myself, I dropped it all (oh, what a wonderful feeling that is) just as I was finishing up so, there is around 50" of 1' and, say 57" of 1 1/4" pipe down there now. This was 3 or 4 weeks ago.

    As a side note: When I first dropped it, I could hear bubbles so I had assumed it was under water but as I tried to fish it out, it apparently is not (no water on the pole as I touched it. We had had a lot of rain this summer and it stopped just as I started working on the well so, not sure if the water level dropped or not, leaving the top of the pipe above water level now. I only mention the levels as it may be significant for a few reasons.

    I read this forum on fishing it out and I may try more but lets just assume I can't get it out for now and I can't really can get it done professionally so, it has to stay.

    I wanted to use the poly pipe for easier installation by one man but since I had some pvc from the old unit, it was less expensive to go that route. I now see from this site, Poly is fine to use for this, right? or is that not ok for a jet pump and only submersibles? Even if it's not the perfect way to do it, since it's a one man installation, I'm hoping I can get away with it but, need to be sure it'll work for plan B.

    Main concern, I'm not going to be able to get the ejector past the other pipes in the 4" well, right? And the best I can hope for is to get the polypipe 2 pipe system with the ejector, down to the other dropped pipe and then go with a single drop pipe to 25' beyond that. Is that correct?

    I'm afraid if it were possible to use smaller 2 pipes to get by the old pipe, I'm already pushing the limits with this 3/4hp pump and that won't work either. Or I'm pushing the limits already.

    Am I going to get even a decent water pressure with this 3/4hp pump as that will put everything about 20 to 25' below water level and about 60' total in my approximately 85' deep well?

    I've other questions but, I'll just stop there for now, see what I end up needing and any help or corrections you can throw at me would be much appreciated. I don't want to muck this one up.

    Not sure the exact water level now, I can check tomorrow though. I'd guess it's at roughly 40 - 45'
  2. VAWellDriller

    VAWellDriller Member

    Messages:
    171
    Location:
    Richmond, VA
    If you can get the new assembly by the dropped materials you should be okay, but I think you need to get the dropped pipe out. Being so shallow, it shouldn't be that hard. I would airlift it out; run a line of poly pipe do the bottom, and rent a 185 cfm compressor, and let it rip. I bet anything it will be out in 5 minutes, for about $150.00.
  3. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    Thanks, Va, yes, I do want it out of there but for the sake of keeping costs down, I need to do what I can to get around it.

    I'm looking at the ejector housing here and it is possible I could get it past the other stuff but now, I'm considering those big fat couplings so, maybe not. I will, however be able to get a single pipe around it or at least I'm reasonably sure I can. But at a 25' limit and if that water level fluctuates to much, I could go dry.

    This is a convertible deep well/shallow well ejector and I can grind or cut the tabs off to help some, but, it's going to be a mighty tight squeeze still, if not impossible to go past it with two pipes.

    I need to get a level on the water before I make any decisions and maybe someone here can give me an idea of water level fluctuations under worse case drought conditions.

    This is just something temporary anyway and If I can make it easy to get it in and out with the poly pipe, I might be able to squeeze by for a couple of years till I can do a better job.
  4. justwater

    justwater Well Drilling/Service

    Messages:
    327
    Location:
    FL/GA
    was that a typo or is there only 5 feet of broke pipes and jet in the well? what is water level? what depth is the broke pipes again? from looking a the other ends u have, do either appear broke clean? have you tried running a few joints (with bell ends, not couplings) facing down to the broke pipe to see if you can catch onto it, tap it on and bring it all up?
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2012
  5. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    I don't see the typo but it's about 50ft of pipe. No breaks. There is around 50ft of 1" and, say 57ft of 1 1/4" pipe down there. The 1" is a normal pipe size, no bell and the other and something important I forgot to mention, has a clean coupling on the end that would be the best point to grab/hook it. I've some ideas on how to hook it under the coupling that I'll try. I'm thinking that old ridged rake cut down to fit might get it. It's around 40ft down and I've only tried to loop it with the wire from the submersible running through a 45ft 3/4inch pvc pipe but, I did a dry run on that and it would likely slip off if I did manage to loop the coupling.

    I see I have my inches and feet symbols all mixed up, sorry.
  6. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    have you tried running a few joints (with bell ends, not couplings) facing down to the broke pipe to see if you can catch onto it, tap it on and bring it all up?

    Now that option is possible but, I'm thinking you are thinking it's just the 5ft due to my typo and maybe it would slip off with the weight of 2 50ft pipes full of water?
  7. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa DIYer, not in the trades

    Messages:
    3,974
    Location:
    NW Ontario, Canada
    I would take VAWellDriller's advice.
  8. justwater

    justwater Well Drilling/Service

    Messages:
    327
    Location:
    FL/GA
    i thought you meant 50 feet. i've pulled over 50' of pipe up out of a well with a sub on the end using the method i mentioned. i always used a bell end though as there is a much longer socket compared to a standard coupling. when you jam pvc into a bell end its a bitty to pull it apart.

    airlifting sounds cool and all, but if theres a 2 pipe jet in a 4" well i dont see how it will work..
    [​IMG]
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2012
  9. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    Good point, JW and there is a clean male end on the 1 1/4" that'll accept that bell.

    Definitely something to consider.
  10. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    When I say "consider", I mean I will try it, I just have transportation issues now but will get my brother out here, hopefully in a few days to get me to where I can get what I need. I used my last bell end so, it's in the well.

    Right now I guess I need to get ideas and try a few things with what I have on hand as he lives quit a ways off and I'm trying to avoid him making more trips here than necessary.
  11. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    I have to at least get something going here, even if it is just temporary and can think about getting the existing unit out of there later. Brothers coming out tomorrow.

    Does my plan for using poly pipe/tubing for the new unit sound OK? I'll run 2 poly pipes and just not cut them off until I run it down as far as I can. And on the bottom of the ejector I'll do a 25" drop, also using poly to make sure I get past the old pipe enough to get to the water and as deep as I can get it to go.

    One main question: Does it make any difference in pressure if the drop pipe is less than 25ft or is it going to be pretty much the same whether I shorten that or go with the full 25ft? Of course it's best to get as deep as I can but if I'll get substantially more pressure with a shorter single drop pipe, I need to consider that when I build.

    Thanks again for all the help.

    Anything I need to
  12. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    Also, anything I need to avoid, or look for in the poly pipe grade? Not sure if there are different grades or not but, will probably see what's up with that when I get to Home Depot.
  13. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    And yet another. Will the unit tend to bounce around when running and possibly wear a hole in something or do I need some type of baffle to avoid that?
  14. justwater

    justwater Well Drilling/Service

    Messages:
    327
    Location:
    FL/GA
    you are only gonna be able to drop the jet down to about 30-40' where it will hit the first broke pipe right? if so, put at least 25' of tail under it, 30' wouldnt be terrible. this way there is no chance the pump will get air because it wont pump water from more than 25' under the jet. btw you never said what the current water level is.

    i would get that crap out of the well and put another sub in... probably even a cheap big box sub over the jet pump. the 3/4 pump with the jet and all the stuff to hook it up couldnt have been that much cheaper than a sub.. unless its a cheap big box pump too.
  15. Dropper

    Dropper New Member

    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Florida
    Right. The water level is 42 ft from top and I was able to easily get the 30ft tail almost completely under water, plenty of depth. Yes, the above ground was not much less than the cheap sub. There were a few factors that made me go the above ground route. I had no idea how reliable the cheap subs were, still don't, and though I'm not even sure how reliable the above ground is, in my case, needing to work on this myself, right or wrong, I was more comfortable with above ground. Plus, I really didn't have a choice due to the dropped pipe and no way to get it out at the time.

    Times will get better as this was just a bad few months for expenses with the broken car too and if I'm not happy with the pressure, it's easy enough to yank, get a guy out to pull the other pipe and go in with another sub. That could also give me time to find just a used good pump, put the good sub motor on it and go that route, if I want. I'll finish up tomorrow and see how the pressure goes.

    Thanks for the tip on the 30 instead of 25ft
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