Old shower floor has no pan..

Discussion in 'Shower & bathtub Forum & Blog' started by digidutch, Sep 1, 2012.

  1. digidutch

    digidutch New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    Palm Harbor, Fl
    22 year old home. Shower stripped bare (almost) Original floor tiled. The walls were green board.... The only thing that 'waterproofed" was a 6 inch piece of cement wonderboard surrounding the tile area. It has a 3 inch deep 'groove" around were the wonderboard is embedded in. Was thinking of poring cement in surrounding 'trough', make sloping cement floor and put pan liner over original tile floor, followed by thin layer of thinset over liner to begin tiling. Is this a good idea?
  2. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,932
    Location:
    New England
    The tile will crack off! You can't use thinset on the liner. You need a new drain to connect to the liner. Then, you need 1-1/2" or so thick setting bed that you could then attach the tile to. WIthout redoing the curb, it would be too low.

    You're much better off trashing the whole thing and building it per one of the approved methods. While you're taking the rest apart, you may want to check out the drain and trap - if they're cast iron verses say pvc or abs, they may need repair or replacement.
  3. digidutch

    digidutch New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    Palm Harbor, Fl
    Thank you for your response. I meant to do setting bed first before thinset for tiles. Curb (2x4's) came up while taking tiles off of it....Will redo it correctly (concrete instead of 2x4's?). What if I pour concrete to make a level base followed by sloping mud deck, liner, setting bed, thinset, tiles. Height is not really much of an issue, just make curb higher. Will need new drain. Do I just cut off the old and attach extended pipe for new drain, it appears to be pvc/plastic. Or if I take floor tiles off and smoothen it (It is sloped) put mud deck, etc. Would this work? Thanks.
  4. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,932
    Location:
    New England
    IF the existing tiled floor is solid and sloped properly, you could use it as your preslope. This may make it higher than you'd like, but maybe not. Depending on the drain that is there, it's possible, but unlikely, there's enough adjustment to raise it to the needed level. To get it out and replace, you'd probably need an inside pipe cutter and to dig out some of the tile/cement/mortar around the existing drain to then have enough room to install a new drain.

    Or, if you tear things out, there are other systems that can be used to install a new, long-lasting shower. In FL, with the heat and high humidity, my preference would be to use a surface membrane construction method rather than a conventional one. This puts the waterproof layer immediately below the tile so there's very little to get wet and what does can dry out faster. This leads to less mold and mildew. There are a bunch of 'system's out there, but to give you and idea, go here and watch the videos http://www.schluter.com/5288.aspx. The benefits of a surface applied waterproofing system apply for all systems, but this gives you the highlights and an idea of the how-to.
  5. digidutch

    digidutch New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    Palm Harbor, Fl
    Looks good. After I took the floortiles off as well as the strips of wonderboard around the floor I found that the builder put on some piece of cbu on the foor under the tiles, hoping that would waterproof the whole thing. The drain is one of those screw in kind. Could I just use a screw in piece with pipe glued and put new drain on it? Thinking of filling the voids on the perimeter with concrete, make mud bed on current slope with new drainpipe and go with membrane. This shower really does not get used a lot. Seems the cost for system is high. What do you think?
  6. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,932
    Location:
    New England
    This exceeds my level of knowledge! A picture of what's there may help.
  7. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple I love these ACO Shower Drains - Best in Class

    Messages:
    4,026
    Location:
    North Vancouver, BC
    I bet you have a clamping drain somewhere down there. You can remove everything but the bottom collar.

    Make a simple pre-slope out of almost any type of mortar for maybe $15.00

    A new rubber liner will cost about $20-$30.00

    Some sand and cement $35.00

    If you get a new clamping drain that can cost as little as $20.00. Bring the old top around and find a new one that matches the bolt holes.

    Test plug $3.00

    A bag of thin-set and grout $30.00

    Total investment under $200.00

    cUPC approved drain
    cUPC approved liner

    No headaches.

    This will meet the Universal Building Code and Plumbing Code in Florida.

    No sense cutting corners and building something that can harm your home and your health. Water is the route of so much damage in a home - building a shower need not be expensive.

    Your health is not worth a $50.00 savings.
  8. digidutch

    digidutch New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    Palm Harbor, Fl
    Can I cut the old drain down to 2" pipe and just glue new drain over the pipe. This will give me new drain for pan liner membrane. The current slope is from the old (removed) floor tiles. I will re-use it, should I cover with thin layer of mud deck or just put liner on it. It is smooth. What you say is exactly what I am going to do. Thanks all for the info. This is a fun project.
  9. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,932
    Location:
    New England
    You can use the existing slope. Hassle is, you may have trouble getting the new clamping drain at the proper level. And, getting the old one out could be more than just cutting it out.
  10. digidutch

    digidutch New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    Palm Harbor, Fl
    I think it will raise the floor but we have 9 foot ceiling so....no biggie. I am going to try to cut the old drain pipe from inside and weld/put new drain over it. Both are 2inch should work.
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