No drain trap is ok?

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by Joy927, Oct 4, 2012.

  1. Joy927

    Joy927 New Member

    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Chicago
    I am still waiting for their response. Hope they can fix this. If not, I will contact with the guy you recommended. Do you know he can do tile too? We have to break the floor tile to fix the drain.
  2. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,059
    Location:
    New England
    To ensure that the waterproofing is intact, you'll likely need to tear out most if not all of the shower pan to install a trap. To do that properly, you have to go up the walls at least 6" or so as well. The shower pan liner needs to go up at least a couple of inches above the top of the curb, which is why you'd need to tear out part of the walls, which is likely to include the curb. You may be able to take out less, but then you'd be making extra seams. Based on how they did the current install, they may have not done a proper job with the liner, so it may be better to tear the curb out as well. This is not an easy fix. It would have been an easy thing done right from the beginning. Before the new tile and setting bed is installed, it should have a flood test to check for leaks.
  3. Joy927

    Joy927 New Member

    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Chicago
    Thank you

    They told me that they will brake four floor tiles to install ptrap. I do not think they put liner underneath. I saw they put cements and tiles only. I am getting tired of dealing with them. How can I know if they put ptrap in the tub drain....
  4. Joy927

    Joy927 New Member

    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Chicago
    Thank you so much for lots of help. I would like to get some help. Is anything aware of when they install ptrap in the shower drain? Is any rule such as ptrap length or degree.... I would appreciate. Thank you so much.
  5. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,059
    Location:
    New England
    A shower pan MUST be waterproof to pass inspection and for successful, long-term reliability of your entire house...this requires some waterproof layer and cement and tile are NOT what waterproofs a shower, they are only the decorative, wear layer. It would be nearly imposible to tear out the floor of a shower around the drain without destroying the liner, if it exists (and it MUST).

    If there's no liner, it is not a shower that would pass code anywhere. Did the installer pull a building permit for this? Are they licensed? Was it inspected? Well, I guess that last question is moot, no inspector would pass an install without a trap or a liner.

    There's a reason why a building permit is required and the associated inspection. Yes, it can cost a bit (not necessarily a lot), but it protects you in the long run. If these people do not have a plumbing license, it is my understanding that legally, you don't have to pay them. It could get ugly, but you'd win. Best to consult a lawyer.

    Personally, from what I've heard (and I'm not there), the entire thing was not built to any accepted standards. IF that is true, you'd win in court, if it got that far. Looking pretty on the outside is only one part of the install...the structure must be correct for it to function.
  6. Joy927

    Joy927 New Member

    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Chicago
    They said there are actually ptrap somewhere, but they are not working properly. They will anyway fix these.

    I already paid the full amount $9000.

    Can I still get an inspection before they fix? How can I find the inspector? Thank you so much for your help.
  7. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,059
    Location:
    New England
    An inspection usually comes in stages...the rough-in to verify the drain and supply lines are installed properly, then often a flood test, to verify that the shower pan is installed properly, and sometimes a third after everything is finished (not all places do this one). To get a proper inspection starts with pulling a building permit, and if done now, the whole thing might have to be torn out since the rough-in isn't visible to be checked.

    See what one of the pros has to say that deals with this, but a true pro would have taken the time to pull a permit, get the inspections, and do it right the first time to prevent this from happening in the first place. Because the work was started without a permit, there could be a fine as well...the building permit people are part of city hall, but exactly where their offices are, you'd have to check.

    A trap cannot be shared with other fixtures in the bathroom. And, to prevent accumulations of soap scum, hair, skin flakes, and who knows what in a long trap arm (the pipe going to the trap), it is best to have the trap immediately below the drain opening in the shower which keeps that trap arm short. That vertical pipe self cleans better than one turning and going a distance horizontally, too.
  8. classic140

    classic140 New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Location:
    SW Arkansas
    I share your pain Joy927. The same thing has happened to me! My out-of-pocket costs is only about $500 for a 1-piece shower install on the 2nd floor (without a ptrap).
    The pro's on this forum have provided a straight answer that I really appreciate!!
    You guys are the best.... now I have the knowledge & confidence to confront my contractor.

    Thank you, TerryLove forum!
    A frustrated homeowner in SW Ark.
  9. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,689
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    Do they need a license for what they did? Yes. Can the do the work without a license. Yes, assuming they do not get caught. Call the building department and have an inspector check whether it was done properly and if they are licensed to do it.
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