Need Insulated toilet tank, worried about low flush toilets

[Terry]

We installed a nice Toto Supreme one-piece MS864114-51 in black last Friday.
I have a nice deal on the ADA Supreme in black, just one at $430

Some people like the taller bowls. The ADA is worth it for them.
If you don't have room for the 28" long bowl, then the regular is 26.5" long.

 

[Gary Swart]

Unless there are young children or other very short people, go with the ADA. You can "test sit" ADA toilets at almost any public rest room. I can attest that as the years take the toil on the knees, you will celebrate the day you went ADA. Elongated vs round. Because of the obvious difference in anatomy, males are much less likely to have an accident on the elongated. Unless space in front is really, really a problem, that would be my recommendation. I will grant you that a new ADA elongated Toto toilet with a soft close seat is a fairly major expense. But, keep in mind this is something that will be used by the entire family and visitors several time everyday for many years. Other than occasionally having to replace the fill valve and/or flapper (cheap and available parts) this is an investment that will last for many years. A Toto rarely needs plunging and does its flushing job effectively every time. In my opinion, this is money well spent.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[RCraig]

I completely agree with you Gary

If I am not mistaken the current toilet was original to the house built in the 70's. I just hope your good reasoning will convince my husband. For some reason, the elongated ADA bowl is $466 whereas the round ADA is $320 (bowl only not tank). I will start with the elongated ADA and work my way down. RUth

 

[Gary Swart]

Is your husband driving a 1970 car? Are your kitchen appliances from 1970? How about clothes? Still wearing polyester leisure suit with white shoes and belt? Still watching a 1970 TV? How about your computer? All of these things have changed, been modified, replaced over the years, why not bring the toilet into the 21st century. BTW spread that $146 dollar difference over it's less than $5 per year.

 

[RCraig]

'85 Volvo, stick shift

Well I love old cars, just had to move to a 2004. I do admit, I fought the inability to open my own windows (manually) as hard as I could. Also, I never thought I could live with an automatic. Now that I have automatic windows and steering, I like it! I would like to be able to adjust my own seat. On the other hand, this car remembers my settings and readjusts for me when I use my push button key. That is another thing I have gotten used to, locking and unlocking from afar.

Anyway, your points are well taken. Also, I can perhaps mention how much water we will be saving, and he has been complaining about the increasing water bill. Ruth

Before '85 Volvo, I was driving a '65 Mercury Comet. R

 

[RCraig]

1.6 versus 1.28

Husband agreed to the Drake! However, now the plumber tells me that the only one they can find is a 1.28 gal flush, not the 1.6 gal flush. I was already very nervous about the 1.6 gal, given that I have an old 5 gal Am Standard. Perhaps you could give me advice about this - I really don't want to install this ADA elongated $500 toilet and then have a problem. Ruth

 

[RCraig]

1.6 versus 1.28 flush

Husband agreed to the Drake! However, now the plumber tells me that the only one they can find is a 1.28 gal flush, not the 1.6 gal flush. I was already very nervous about the 1.6 gal, given that I have an old 5 gal Am Standard. Perhaps you could give me advice about this - I really don't want to install this ADA elongated $500 toilet and then have a problem. Ruth

 

[Jadnashua]

Numerous people have reported here ...have you used the search function? It works...don't worry!

 

[RCraig]

insulated tank

ok, as far as I understand it, the EcoDrake doesn't come with an insulated tank, so although it can handle 900 grams (ADA Elongated) I think I really need the 1.6 Drake with the insulated tank. Quite confusing to the novice.

E-Max flapper THU277S

 

[Redwood]

Ruth if this helps you out at all I'm in CT. and I have a 1.6 GPF Drake and am experiencing no tank sweating problems...
We have pretty much the same humidity levels!
A 1.28 GPF Drake has the same amount of water in the tank but uses even less than mine you should be fine!

How were them thunder boomers last night? Pretty Stout when they came through here!

 

[RCraig]

ok, thats good to know

Plumber's assistant located a 1.6L Drake with insulated tank somewhere in the greater NH area! ADA, elongated, hopefully my problems are well on the way to being solved. Many thanks to all of you for all of your advice.
My husband agreed to the new toilet, I didn't give him all the choices just told him the price for the ADA/elongated. I told him that if we wanted to save money, we could install it ourselves with the instructions here on the internet. Needless to say, he thought it would be better to have the plumber install it. Maybe because that worry was over, I must have slept very well and didn't hear the thunderstorms. However, looking outside you would think we lived in Seattle. Too wet to go on my morning walk this AM. Thanks to all of you, Ruth

 

[Redwood]

Good deal! In the average home that translates to about a 15% drop in water usage! when you go from 3.5 GPF to 1.6 GPF.

 

[RCraig]

Installation next Wed

And if I am not mistaken, my current toilet is so old that it uses even more than 3.5 gallons. R

 

[RCraig]

A note

I went walking around the pond behind where I work this afternoon, since it was raining this morning. Storms must have been strong - 2 huge trees are down, floating in the pond.
If any problems with the Drake, I will be back on this forum next week. Again, I appreciate all of your help. R

 

[capecodjean]

Hi All,

No sense in posting a new question since I also have an old American Standard with condensation problems. After reading the forum, which is very informative, my only question is about the Toto Drake is this. Is the CST743SD with siphon jet flushing ( they call it G-Max flushing) a normal flush or one of those pressure flushes? Hate those loud "sucking" flushes. I know that the ST743SD is highly recommended but only the CST743SD is listed on the web site.

Thanks!

 

[Terry]

The ST743SD tank is an insulated 1.6 gallon tank that will fit onto a round C743E bowl, the C744E elongated bowl and the C744EL ADA bowl.

All of these combinations work well.

 

[Jadnashua]

To my knowledge, none of the Toto toilets are pressure assisted. Some of the really fancy Neorest line I think have a built-in pump. So, no, the Totos are relatively quiet in their flush.

 

[Gary Swart]

Jean, it's your buck, but quite a bit has been written about why the new low flow toilets really do not need an insulated tank. Think of this. If you fill a glass with very cold water on a hot day, water droplet will condense on the outside of the glass. But, if you take the same glass that is half full of water at room temperature and fill it on up with very cold water, the water in the glass will be tempered to a point where little if any condensation will occur. Now to carry this a step further, when you flush a toilet that uses only 1.28 gallons, you only use approximately 1/2 of the tank's supply. That remaining 1/2 tank has been sitting there for a period of time, and is going to be at or near room temperature unless the toilet is being used nonstop. Further more, the 1.28 gallons of water that refills the tank has been sitting the the pipe since the last flush and is not going to be ice cold. You old water hog using all of the 3.5 gallons of waterand refilled with at least some very cold water because the pipe didn't hold 3.5 gallons. Toto does not make a pressure assisted toilet.

 

[LLigetfa]

As you mentioned, this "glass half empty" theory may work if the toilet is not used very often giving the water time to become tepid. When I plumbed my home, I tapped off the far end of the hot and cold lines with a mixing valve to supply the toilets. This way the water is always tepid regardless of how much use the toilet gets.

I had heavy use toilet bowls sweat despite the tank itself being insulated. A mixing valve solved it.

 

[Jadnashua]

As I said, if the toilet is used often, insulation will not stop the tank from getting cold enough to sweat. The only way is to add a tempering valve. On most wells, there's a bladder tank that holds a fair amount of water. Depending on where that is, the water you use, unless it is a lot, will warm up some, then, you have the water already in the pipes that is likely warmer, then you have about 1/2 the tank mixing with whatever comes in to refill it. Yes, a tank can sweat, but it is much rarer than with the old water hogs.