need advice for replacement of shut-off valves

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice' started by cjs1996, Dec 28, 2006.

  1. cjs1996

    cjs1996 New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Location:
    Texas
    Hi folks,

    I recently replaced two old cheap faucet shut-off valves (they were the kind where the "speedflex" hose is pre-attached to the valve) with some new 1/4 turn valves that have threaded connections for supply hoses.

    The old ferrule and compression nut would not come off the pipe, so I just intended to attach the new valve with the old ferrule and nut (they are the proper size). Some guys at my local plumbing supply house said this would be OK. (is it really?)

    Then I hit a snag. The "socket" part of the old valve was much deeper than the socket the new valve, so the new valve would not make contact with the old ferrule when I slid it onto the pipe. I was advised to simply saw off enough of the pipe end to shorten the pipe and allow the new valve to make contact with the old ferrule and create a proper seal. I did this, and completed the job with no leaks, but it was NOT EASY sawing through the pipe with a small saw in close quarters.

    We're planning on replacing the low quality "builder's grade" faucets in the other bathrooms, but I'd like to first replace the supply valves for those as well so I can install braided stainless hose which will make the new faucet connections easier (I don't want to reuse the old "speedflex" hose, which I'm told will eventually break after enough movement). After my first experience, described above, I'm thinking I might be better off hiring a plumber.

    I have a few questions:

    What is the proper way to do this job (i.e. when the ferrule won't come off)? Is what I did OK?

    I've read I can get a "puller" tool to remove the old nut+ferrule. If I do remove the old nut & ferrule, is there a chance the old pipe is crimped and therefore a new ferrule wouldn't seal properly if it straddled any part of the crimped area?

    Would it be best to have some sort of threaded connector (sorry, don't know the terminology) soldered onto the existing pipe so I don't have to fool with any more compression fittings and stuck ferrules?

    How would a pro do this job?

    Last, what does a plumber typically charge for a "standard" replacement of a set of 2 shut-off valves for a faucet? I realize every job is different, but even a ball-park figure is OK. Although I did the job for one faucet, the stakes are higher for the next ones because they are upstairs and a leaking connection will be a bit more costly... so I'm thinking about hiring a pro, :)

    Thanks for any advice.
    First time homeowner and plumbing newbie
    Chris
  2. cjs1996

    cjs1996 New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Location:
    Texas
    also..

    I should also add that there isn't enough of the pipe sticking out from the wall to simply cut the pipe behind the existing ferrule... I guess that would be the easiest solution but unfortunately not an option for any of the other shut off valves to be replaced...
  3. Randyj

    Randyj Master Plumber

    Messages:
    1,047
    Location:
    Alabama
    Most plumbers would do jobs like that by the hour.

    I probably would not try to use the same ferrule and would just cut off behind it. If you had a dremmel/hobby tool with a cutting disk that could be one way to do it rather than a saw...most start by trying to use tubing cutters. If it is too close to wall a sleeve coupling and piece of pipe may have to be added.

    Wild guess...1 hr per valve...don't expect to get a pro for less than $60 per hour. Some valves may take 30 minutes and some may take 2 hours.
  4. kordts

    kordts In the Trades

    Messages:
    551
    Location:
    exurban Chicago
    [​IMG]

    Get a stem puller. It's made for these situations. It pulls stems and ferrules off quickly.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 30, 2006
  5. Randyj

    Randyj Master Plumber

    Messages:
    1,047
    Location:
    Alabama
    I need to get me one of them there thangs..... I like kewl tools! Wonder if Harbor Freight carries them....
  6. cjs1996

    cjs1996 New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Location:
    Texas
    puller

    Hi,

    Thanks for the responses, I have a few more questions:

    When "stuck" ferrules are removed with one of these puller tools, are the pipes ever distorted as a result of the previous ferrule being tightened down too much? If so, is there any problem simply installing a new ferrule and nut on the existing pipe?

    Is there any particular brand, and/or style of puller tool you'd recommend? I've found several different ones (that look slightly different in the way they work) with a google search. Or are they all pretty good at what they do?

    Thanks,
    Chris
  7. kordts

    kordts In the Trades

    Messages:
    551
    Location:
    exurban Chicago
    I have seen copper pipe distorted only a couple of times. Usually the supply stop is in a vanity, cabinet or behind the toilet, so the installer can't gorilla them too bad. I have a "dreamtool" that resizes copper pipe, it's perfect in these situations.
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