Muddy Water from deep well

[cmbbossier]

My submersible pump started pumping Very muddy water. I raised my pump 30' (now at 130' deep) thinking that would help but it did not. My check valves are good, one built into pump and one at surface. If I run my pump continuously the water will run clean ( not crystal clear) but good, after about 4 hours. But if I stop the runoff and let my system cycle( on and off) once, it goes back to muddy water again. How can this be? Is my well casing filter broken? It is pumping out ALOT of grey silt until I let it runoff and it clears up again. I have exhausted all my brain power(and my back) trying to fix this. Could "air lifting" the well be a solution?

 

[Reach4]

Does your casing extend above ground?

You might take a look at the Jeremy Harris pump: https://terrylove.com/forums/index....-borehole-supply-in-the-uk.61806/#post-460564

 

[Sponsor]

 

[cmbbossier]

Yes, at least 2-6".

 

[Reach4]

Glad to hear your casing is not below ground. Otherwise there would be concern that there was mud running in from up top.

I tend to think of wells as being fully cased, but I understand that is not so common everywhere. If there is casing down to solid rock and the rock continues down, that apparently works nicely.

I am not a pro. I suspect some kind of well cleaning would do you well if you have a fully cased well. One system uses a big air compressor and blows air to the bottom. Junk comes up like a geyser. I don't know if that would be appropriate for a well where the casing only goes down for a ways and you might have loose material farther down.

The air lift pumps, which I expect you have seen in lots of Youtube videos take much less of a compressor and take more time. They seem more gentle for an unknown situation.

 

[cmbbossier]

I am going to try to get the casing cleaned out, it obviously has a lot of silt in it, but the well service wants $1200 and with the holidays and family it's just really bad timing. I will update this post when I get some results. I just don't understand how it gets clear while running continuously , but when I let it operate normally it gets horribly dirty again.???

 

[Valveman]

I am going to try to get the casing cleaned out, it obviously has a lot of silt in it, but the well service wants $1200 and with the holidays and family it's just really bad timing. I will update this post when I get some results. I just don't understand how it gets clear while running continuously , but when I let it operate normally it gets horribly dirty again.???

I would see about putting a camera down hole first. No sense in spending money on cleaning it out if the casing is broken or has a hole in it.

 

[cmbbossier]

After doing a lot of research, and talking with several well service companies, I have decided that making my own airlift pump and cleaning the well myself will be the most cost effective next step in fixing this problem. As no one anywhere can explain why the water runs clear if running continuously, but gets nasty when running normally. My well driller said my well was 250' deep fully cased and they hit water at 70' down. He had my pump at 160' down, why so high? I set it to 130' thinking it might help for a while but I was wrong. This was the third well he drilled on my property because the first two never cleared up. I'm thinking all three were not developed correctly. Running a camera does sound smart but it is also expensive. Can anyone attempt to explain why the dirty water persists when running like it should? Thanks for all of the ideas and help so far, you guys really got me on the right track. Thanks.

 

[Valveman]

Is it steel or plastic cssing?

 

[cmbbossier]

4" pvc with 20' slotted pipe at bottom for filter packed on outside with rock, supposedly.

 

[Valveman]

Thats a good way to do it. But apparently you have water coming in from somewhere besides the 20' screen. My guess is the casing is cracked up high around the 70' mark. When you turn off the pump the water level goes back up to static at 70' and that is why it is only dirty when it first comes on.

 

[cmbbossier]

Thats a good way to do it. But apparently you have water coming in from somewhere besides the 20' screen. My guess is the casing is cracked up high around the 70' mark. When you turn off the pump the water level goes back up to static at 70' and that is why it is only dirty when it first comes on.

Valveman,
That does make sense. It's not what I wanted to hear, but it does make sense. Thank you sir.

 

[Craigpump]

That is exactly why you need to run a camera to see where the problem is, cleaning the well won't do squat without first fixing the problem.

 

[Valveman]

It could also be that the gravel pack has settled and is no longer covering the entire 20' of the screen. If the well was cemented it is not likely you can add more gravel unless you have a gravel pipe outside the casing.

Either way when you shut off the pump and the water rises to the static level it washes off more mud.

If the casing is not broken all you can do is repeat this process over and over untill you wash the mud out of the top. Run the pump until the water is clean, shut off the pump until water iz back to static level, and keep repeating. You may need a timer to do this for you because it may take days.

 

[Reach4]

Not related to your problem, but it is better to only have the check valve at the pump. Click Inbox above.

 

[cmbbossier]

I made an "airlift" pump and I was able to get 4 ft of sand off the bottom of the casing. I thought there would be more. Pretty sure I was on bottom because I seen some pvc shavings, probably from the casing top being cut off. And it felt different hitting the bottom. Still not good water. I bought an underwater camera, and lowered that with very good video and at 180' the water pressure pushed the off button. Dropped the camera again but the water was black at bottom from stirring sediment the first time.
@! $*#^ I saw no cracks in first 180'.
Casing is 237', water at 60' down, pump at 192'. Installed a new check valve 2' above pump. I couldn't tell if pump check had a rubber seal, still has spring, but i wasn't sure if good. While running water it clears to a point. Running three months now! Still produces a very very fine sediment light grey. Water looks grey.But if i stop running its back to a mud puddle. $8,000 for new well. It doesn't seem that running it out is going to help. Could getting a well service to blow it out with air help? Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Reach4]

Nice going on the airlift pump.

Water looks grey.

When you put the grey water into a glass or glass jar, how long does it take for the sediment to settle out?

 

[cmbbossier]

20-30 min

 

[Reach4]

I tried to turn that into microns, but gave up. Somebody may well know what kind of filtering is called for here. I am not a pro.

I am thinking a Lakos Twist 2 Clean filter followed by two Pentek Big 4.5x20 Blue filter housings in series would be good. These would go after your pressure tank and switch.

If you have an iron or H2S in your water, there is a better solution. A backwashing iron+sulfur filter doubles as a particle filter. The sediment backwashes out along with the iron. (You can have a backwashing filter for just sediment, but doing more at the same time is nice.) I would still follow that with a Pentek Big Blue housing for smaller stuff. You can leave a Big Blue housing empty if you like. I put in 3 BB housings, having bought them before I got my backwashing iron+H2S filter. I leave the first housing empty. Since my BB filters don't have much to deal with, I could leave 2 of the housings empty. But since I go over a year on the filter cartridges, the expense of two cartridges instead of one is minor. I like overkill at times.

When you put in filters, I think it is good to have pressure gauges between stages to judge how the backpressure is doing. Bypass valving is good in case a filter fails including springing a leak. I do not have a bypass. I do keep spare O-rings so that a bad O-ring does not put me out of commission.

 

[PumpMd]

Just to make sure, have you checked the precharge in your pressure tank? 95% of the time we find the problem to be pressure tank stirring the well up and it don't have to be waterlogged to do it, even short cycling can stir the well up.

 

[Craigpump]

I've got one of these jobs tomorrow.

Bedrock well, 42' of casing and the filters are absolutely caked with fines. I thought we'd find a washout at the drive shoe or the "natural" grout was washing in through a verticle fracture....but the camera showed that @91' there is a fracture that is feeding the fines into the well. Since the well makes 15gpm + and there is a 7gpm pump installed, we're going to pull and set the pump @80' and see what happens.