Moving Drain (& supply lines in the way) for shower

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by hiperco, Nov 11, 2011.

  1. hiperco

    hiperco New Member

    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    Hi all. I'm working on my remodeling my bathroom and I've been pestering the kind folks over at the John Bridge forums with tile questions for a while now, so I thought I'd give them a break and stop by here for a bit :)

    I need to move my shower drain, strangely it was located at the front of the previous showing. I will need to route it through a joist to get it located where it needs to be (more toward the center of the opening, toward the left in the bottom picture). I should be ok structurally, these are 2x10's and I'm not in the middle third of the joist. As luck would have it one of the supply lines is totally in the way so I need to re-route it as well. I think my path forward is clear, but I wanted to see if anyone has any comments or concerns before I start cutting, boring, etc. Thanks!



    P1000094 (Medium).jpg IMG_0417 (Medium).jpg IMG_0454 (Medium).jpg
  2. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    I think you're a little confused, the middle third portion of the joist would be in some cases the only place you could bore a hole...

    The top or bottom of a joist should never be notched for piping.
  3. jimbo

    jimbo Plumber

    Messages:
    8,997
    Location:
    San Diego
    I think he means the middle third of the span
  4. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    That could be.
  5. cacher_chick

    cacher_chick Test, Don't Guess!

    Messages:
    3,236
    Location:
    Land of Cheese
    I cannot tell from the picture- is that a basement or a crawlspace below the shower? If so, can the drain line be lowered so the line runs below the joists?
  6. hiperco

    hiperco New Member

    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    This is on the second floor. Don't ask me why there is insulation there, it's above living space. (So running beneath the joist isn't really an option.). FYI tha main waste line for he second floor is just next to this area but not really accessible.
  7. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,249
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    If all the pictures are from inside the shower area, the drain is ALL wrong anyway, (might have been done by a handyman or do-it-yourselfer), because you appear to have an "S" trap which is NOT permitted. As for the hole, your shower appears to be over a lower wall, so the "recommendations" would not apply.
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2011
  8. cacher_chick

    cacher_chick Test, Don't Guess!

    Messages:
    3,236
    Location:
    Land of Cheese
    Good catch HJ, looking at the picture again you are right on.
  9. hiperco

    hiperco New Member

    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    1) Thanks HJ but can you explain what you meant when you said "As for the hole, your shower appears to be over a lower wall, so the "recommendations" would not apply. "

    2) Here are some more pictures. I don't think its an "S", but its close ;)

    3) Do you think there's enough pipe to cut the existing run off at the first 90 deg elbow (counting from the drain), then re-connect from there? Although I'm not sure I can still get the location correct starting from there...

    4) Out of curiosity, is anyone familiar with the existing drain? How was it constructed? I'm thinking the original drain was all one piece down to the PVC "sleeve" that is connected to the short section of pipe just before the 180 trap?

    P1000254 (Medium).jpg P1000255 (Medium).jpg P1000257 (Medium).jpg P1000258 (Medium).jpg P1000259 (Medium).jpg
  10. cacher_chick

    cacher_chick Test, Don't Guess!

    Messages:
    3,236
    Location:
    Land of Cheese
    The problem you face is that you must have a vent coming UP before the point which the drain line turns down. The drain line is going to need to be re-routed to allow for a proper vent.
  11. hiperco

    hiperco New Member

    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    Are you saying that technically I need to ADD a vent to this branch? :eek:
  12. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    Yes indeed.
  13. hiperco

    hiperco New Member

    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    To clarify, the part of the pipe that extends down only runs for a foot or so before connecting to the main waste line which is obviously vented (you can see this connection in one of the pictures above. Does this change anything? (Adding a new vent to this line would be daunting at best!)
  14. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    Like she said, you need a vent before the line turns down, not after.

    Also, how is obvious that the main line is vented if this fixture never was?
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2011
  15. hiperco

    hiperco New Member

    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    There's a giant pipe sticking through the roof in the vicinity of this bathroom :) (and I can just barely see it running up through the far wall in this shower area, next to the toilet flange)

    FWIW, I'm certain this is "original issue" from when the house was built about 30 years ago (I guess the inspector was off that day :( ). I've owned the house for about 12 years, and the trap has functioned fine as far as I know. I know its not correct, but it seems to work ;) Not sure how it could be brought up to code without major intrusion, but I'll ponder it futher (thanks for the replies!)
  16. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    I urge you to correct this issue. Although it has not yet been a problem for you, it would be a damn shame to finish the bathroom only to have a trap that sucks dry and allows sewer gas into the house.

    Excuse my crude drawing, I'm not sure what your downstairs looks like. I think I noticed a wall your vent could rise up inside of.
    [​IMG]
  17. hiperco

    hiperco New Member

    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    Thanks, how about an Air Admittance Valve (AAV) inside that wall, with an access panel? I live in NYS and from what I can see in the NY Plumbing Code they are allowed?
  18. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    What is above this bath room?

    Attic, another room etc.?
  19. hiperco

    hiperco New Member

    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    Above is an unfinished attic. Truss construction, no floor, at least a foot of blown-in insulation. I've been up there before balancing between the trusses, trying not to put my foot (or body) through the ceiling below, its not a fun place ;)

    Here's a zoomed out view:

    Attached Files:

  20. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    It looks like the stud bay I proposed you go up in is wide open right now...

    A pair of coveralls, a saw, a tee, some pipe, and glue are all you need to do this properly... Have a helper cut your pipe to length and pass it up to you in the attic if you wish.

    Doing it properly means you wont have to replace anything again down the road, that cannot be said about using an AAV.
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