Mold
- Thread starter NurseDoe
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Geniescience
Homeowner
no war; no dumb words
ian
it is great to see you saying what you feel. Another thread about this -- you can start one in Terry's corner -- will bring in discussion on what insurance is and isn't, and what real-life stories people can describe from around the world.
in my view, there is nowhere in the world where insurers are as you described above.
you don't seem to have a clear view on risk and cost of risk. If you were an insurance company, you would be bankrupt at some future point, when just enough claims have come in and been paid out because of your nice attitude.
no matter how you edit the words, your message is still clear, and it could start a long war-of-the-words, as there are just so many things to pick up on.
david
ian
it is great to see you saying what you feel. Another thread about this -- you can start one in Terry's corner -- will bring in discussion on what insurance is and isn't, and what real-life stories people can describe from around the world.
in my view, there is nowhere in the world where insurers are as you described above.
you don't seem to have a clear view on risk and cost of risk. If you were an insurance company, you would be bankrupt at some future point, when just enough claims have come in and been paid out because of your nice attitude.
no matter how you edit the words, your message is still clear, and it could start a long war-of-the-words, as there are just so many things to pick up on.
david
Sponsor
Paid Advertisement
Getting back to the mold issue.......I have not tried but have heard good reports on a disinfectant called Nokout. Mostly it's an odor killer but has different uses in different concentrations. I ordered some recently to test on tobacco odor.
Mort
Mort
NurseDoe
Member
No, not the body, I meant the bathroom! I was refering to housekeeping or lack of it.
I do think that mold affects everyone differently, just as pollen affects some people, making them miserable all season.
I do think that mold affects everyone differently, just as pollen affects some people, making them miserable all season.
Mike50
DIY Senior Member
I don't doubt that some people are hypersensitive/allergic to air born mold spores and thats how this all started.
So they need to be vigilant---but why scare others who aren't??
That being said the body is amazingly resiliant to foreign bodies.
Millions and millions of people are allergic to dogs and cats. Thats proven and documented.
"Woman hospitalized with cat allergy" just doesn't sell newspapers.
Lets see an unbiased expert's critical evidence that air born household mold is a serious health hazard. Thats all I'm saying and I've never seen it......
Mike
So they need to be vigilant---but why scare others who aren't??
That being said the body is amazingly resiliant to foreign bodies.
Millions and millions of people are allergic to dogs and cats. Thats proven and documented.
"Woman hospitalized with cat allergy" just doesn't sell newspapers.
Lets see an unbiased expert's critical evidence that air born household mold is a serious health hazard. Thats all I'm saying and I've never seen it......
Mike
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Mike50
DIY Senior Member
Ian Gills said:
There have been successfull claims/lawsuits against builders and insurance companies in the US for physical damage caused by mold.
Not so much regarding medical claims.
The CDC (Center for disease control) apparently says that *No causal link between mold and serious illness has been established*
A few points to consider:
*Mold has been around since the dawn of man.
*Many different molds exist
*Toxic molds are considered rare.
This is nothing like an asbestos claim (for example)-a material installed by
a contractor.
I think one reason that you wont see many class action payouts as in asbestos cases is that W.R Grace Co. had very deep pockets.
The contractor who installed your drywall or dishwasher do not.
The Jury is still out on many mold issues.
Mike
Unfortunately here is the bottom line regarding a serious illness. If and when it happens to anyone I can promise one thing everyone will do. Everyone will ask and wonder what had caused it. A movie will play in your mind with remembering everything you ever had come even remotely, in contact with. Along, with that comes regret.
Geniescience
Homeowner
it's unsanitary. You need clean living. Clear to me and to millions of others.
The threshold is different for everyone, before allergies or allergy like problems develop. This may be true of many other health problems. NurseDoe what say you? Why do some people die of (say, Ebola) while others who may even carry away the infected bodies DON'T catch the disease? Is it just the body's immune system being right ON, on that day?
If anyone reading this is sick, please know that i take this subject seriously.
david
The threshold is different for everyone, before allergies or allergy like problems develop. This may be true of many other health problems. NurseDoe what say you? Why do some people die of (say, Ebola) while others who may even carry away the infected bodies DON'T catch the disease? Is it just the body's immune system being right ON, on that day?
If anyone reading this is sick, please know that i take this subject seriously.
david
Mike50
DIY Senior Member
Cookie, your insurance carrier paid to have a bath, walls & floors ripped up-disinfected etc. It sounds like your problem was *Severe*.
I hope that it solved some health issues for you.
My posts are regarding the average joe with some black mold that could be
dealt with effectively with a spray bottle of bleach/water.
Really basic hygiene will keep colonies of microbes to a minimum.
You cannot get rid of all the bugs.
Many Americans and Japanese are obsessive compulsive about germs & odors....
They buy into fear which of course drives excessive consumerism.
but that's for another thread.......
Mike
I hope that it solved some health issues for you.
My posts are regarding the average joe with some black mold that could be
dealt with effectively with a spray bottle of bleach/water.
Really basic hygiene will keep colonies of microbes to a minimum.
You cannot get rid of all the bugs.
Many Americans and Japanese are obsessive compulsive about germs & odors....
They buy into fear which of course drives excessive consumerism.
but that's for another thread.......
Mike
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Well, my problem appeared to be just an average problem. Maybe, using only a spray bottle of bleach and water would cure...until, all hell let loose. Yep, it was severe. The bad thing about mold is you can't really judge what you can't see, and don't go by sniffing for it because that doesn't work either. Until we know everything about mold that there is to know I would suggest to be very careful with it. I don't know if it caused my illness I don't rule out anything. Although kind of funny, I cured the mold problem and I say this knocking on wood and crossing my fingers that I have been NHL free since then. It is cheaper to get rid of mold by the way than the 60 to 90,000 dollar chemo agents I had been on.
NurseDoe
Member
It will be awhile before I get to that BIG job. Mine is taking forever. Although, I am sure I will be faster and better with a little more experience under my belt, I am certain that 1950's will bring its own unique problems. So, I may wait until after I take national boards, later this year, so I can devote more time for study. DIY really, really, does take 3 times longer than you think.
But, I will be very, very careful with everything in that room. Masks, gowns, gloves. Like surgery. The shop vacs seem to be right under 100.00, and I think it would save so much of my clean up time.
I have super duper mold cleaner from cousin Nick and will use it everywhere. He bought it for a job to remove a lot of mold from a house. He showed pictures of the house inside walls with green and black furry stuff everywhere. He looked at how much was there and told the owner "No way". So, I got the mold killer stuff.
But, I will be very, very careful with everything in that room. Masks, gowns, gloves. Like surgery. The shop vacs seem to be right under 100.00, and I think it would save so much of my clean up time.
I have super duper mold cleaner from cousin Nick and will use it everywhere. He bought it for a job to remove a lot of mold from a house. He showed pictures of the house inside walls with green and black furry stuff everywhere. He looked at how much was there and told the owner "No way". So, I got the mold killer stuff.
Geniescience
Homeowner
Both true (they take it too far), and it is also very dangerous in many situations too.Mike50 said:
"Really basic hygiene" isn't a valid response when a small leak has enabled mold to colonize your stud cavities. Then, nothing you do in the visible living area "will keep colonies of microbes to a minimum." This happens often. A house gets mold growing inside the walls and nobody knows until everyone feels cranky and sick, and then someone gets really sick, with something else that is diagnosable.
All the occupants had their immune systems weakened, and one person got sick first. It might be the law of averages, or it might be the one person who spent the most time in the building. Happens to workaholics at work in sick buildings, and home workers in residential buildings.
david
NurseDoe
Member
I was trying in a really nice way to say my son and wife are the most slovenly people living on the planet. I am not talking forgot to clean the bathroom this week. I am talking this year. Seriously. The bathroom that butts up to it is the same age and does not show the same amount of yuckiness. In their very WEAK defense, neither bath is vented b/c I guess that they didn't do that back in the day.
Some is most likely a hidden leaky something, somewhere. We won't know until we get in there and rip out the walls. I am getting to be the Queen of drywall. BTW, we will be using mold resistant drywall everywhere, tile on all the floors and everything else we can think of to keep the risk to minimum. Probably new insulation everywhere. I am thinking that stuff has been up there 60 years or so, it must be yucky.
Some is most likely a hidden leaky something, somewhere. We won't know until we get in there and rip out the walls. I am getting to be the Queen of drywall. BTW, we will be using mold resistant drywall everywhere, tile on all the floors and everything else we can think of to keep the risk to minimum. Probably new insulation everywhere. I am thinking that stuff has been up there 60 years or so, it must be yucky.
Nursedoe, don't feel badly about your kids they got minds of their own. By the way, bad housekeeping isn't going to cause a mold problem. As far as germs, at least the germs are their own, lol. I hate going into a public restroom. Even if it looks sterile we all know the germs are there and greater in number and potential health problems than ever found in our own at home. My problem which eventually ruined my bathroom was from a roof leak and the gutters, something about the apron (?) not being put on right. Soooo, when we had heavy rains it rained into the walls. How nice. I guess when the walls couldn't hold anymore it started onto the floor. Under the floor. To be honest with you Nursedoe, I guess my good housekeeping kept what would had been a musty, moldy smell at bay. Didn't smell a thing. Only smelled nice things, candles, aromatic things I use. I can't say the mold caused my cancer, but I know for a fact it did cause my pnuemonia I had twice. I had the mold tested.
Mike50
DIY Senior Member
One premium mold inhibiting paint primer to consider when ready to re-paint:
http://www.kilz.com/pages/default.aspx?NavID=29
Zinsser also makes one.
Mike
http://www.kilz.com/pages/default.aspx?NavID=29
Zinsser also makes one.
Mike
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Geniescience
Homeowner
kilz only says mildew-resistant. That means it holds up well when mildew grows on it. Stays intact, holds up, resists falling apart, etc.
it's not bad.
reminds me of how a lot of people used to refer to greenboard as waterproof, but actually it just holds up well when water is present, remains rigid instead of turning to mush. It's not bad either.
david
it's not bad.
reminds me of how a lot of people used to refer to greenboard as waterproof, but actually it just holds up well when water is present, remains rigid instead of turning to mush. It's not bad either.
david
Mike50
DIY Senior Member
geniescience said:
Well for right now most people doing remodels use products like Kilz or Zinsser
It's either that or pay a guy in a hazmat suit to gas the bathroom with chlorine every week.
You sure as hell blow up the minutiae David.
Mike
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Kiril
New Member
I'm in the process of rebuilding my gutted house due to a toxic black mold infestation. Here are some things I have picked up not only from my education, but from extensive research on the subject and recommendations from several industrial hygienists.
Bleach is not the recommended method of getting rid of mold. If you do use bleach, it should be wiped not sprayed.
Encapsulation is only recommended for temporary containment.
Anything infested with mold other than framing members should be discarded.
If you have mold on the framing members, or mold was in contact with them. sand with HEPA vac. With regard to those shop vacs, if your not filtering the exhaust as well, your not doing yourself any favors. You also need to pay attention to the particle size it will filter.
Containment is critical to keep the spores from spreading throughout the house, or into areas that have already been remediated.
With regard to hype, I will agree in some cases maybe. However, when you see as many reports as I have of possible mold related sickness and have talked to many people who have gotten sick in moldy houses and apartments, it is not a leap to point at mold as being the cause. In most of the cases, when these people leave the infested area they get better.
My house is the perfect example. Prior to buying it, it was rented out. After discovering the mold, we talked to the last tenant who lived there. She said her son was sick all the time, and she had gotten sick several times. but they both got better when they moved. Funny thing is, the black mold spore counts were the highest in his room. Coincidence, maybe, but probably not.
Your never going to get rid of mold spores, but you can keep them at levels in your house that will not cause problems for most people.
Bleach is not the recommended method of getting rid of mold. If you do use bleach, it should be wiped not sprayed.
Encapsulation is only recommended for temporary containment.
Anything infested with mold other than framing members should be discarded.
If you have mold on the framing members, or mold was in contact with them. sand with HEPA vac. With regard to those shop vacs, if your not filtering the exhaust as well, your not doing yourself any favors. You also need to pay attention to the particle size it will filter.
Containment is critical to keep the spores from spreading throughout the house, or into areas that have already been remediated.
With regard to hype, I will agree in some cases maybe. However, when you see as many reports as I have of possible mold related sickness and have talked to many people who have gotten sick in moldy houses and apartments, it is not a leap to point at mold as being the cause. In most of the cases, when these people leave the infested area they get better.
My house is the perfect example. Prior to buying it, it was rented out. After discovering the mold, we talked to the last tenant who lived there. She said her son was sick all the time, and she had gotten sick several times. but they both got better when they moved. Funny thing is, the black mold spore counts were the highest in his room. Coincidence, maybe, but probably not.
Your never going to get rid of mold spores, but you can keep them at levels in your house that will not cause problems for most people.
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