Moen Posi-temp volume

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by Hube, Oct 2, 2004.

  1. Hube

    Hube New Member

    Messages:
    156
    Location:
    Ontario
    I have a Moen posi-temp in a shower enclosure. It controls the water temp just fine. Its valve lever is either on or off. I would like to lessen the amount of water by about half. Is this,(as I have heard) not wise because it may damage the cartridge. ? I am considering installing adjusting valves in the lines just before coming into the posi-temp control. Any thoughts on this would be appreciated.. Thanks Hube

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    Last edited by a moderator: May 20, 2009
  2. Deb

    Deb Plumber

    Messages:
    200
    Location:
    Idaho
    Deb

    I have never heard this about the Posi-Temp and cannot really imagine that it is true. A clogged showerhead would perform the same function and I have never heard of this condition causing cartridge damage.
    You could make your own flow restrictor. If this is a Moen shower head, the factory installed flow restrictor is basically a thick washer like thing that has holes to limit the amount of water. Alot of people take them out. Remove the shower head and see if it is there. If it is and the flow is still too much, you can remove it and make one out of rubber, plastic, aerator pieces, etc. with smaller holes or add another (thin) restricter on top of it. If there is not one there at all, you can either make or buy one. Moen will probably send you one if you e-mail them. If you make one, you want to make sure that the edges and all holes you drill are smooth and free of debris that can clog up the even smaller holes of the shower head. If you make one, though, you can experiment and get it perfectly suited to your taste.
    I commend you for your water conservation. We were discussing the horrendous (and IMHO extravegantly wasteful) amount of water that some systems with multiple body sprays and shower heads use on another forum just today. I really commend you for your water conversation efforts, what ever your reason.
    Deb
    The Pipewench
  3. jimbo

    jimbo Plumber

    Messages:
    8,997
    Location:
    San Diego
    Check with ALsons or other manufacuters of shower heads,or a good plumbing supply, for a volume button you could attach ahead of the shower head. I believe this would be preferrable to messing with the water ahead of the control valve.
  4. Hube

    Hube New Member

    Messages:
    156
    Location:
    Ontario
    Thanks, Deb for your reply. I had been in touch with Moen's product service, and they said it has to have a operation pressure of tAT LEAST 20 psi. My pump is set at 30-50, and operates fine. When I mentioned to them about putting a restriction in before the posi-temp valve to cut it down about 50 % they said that is a no-no. They even said that not to cut it down after the control either (as you suggested by partially blocking the shower head perforations)

    Jimbo; Also thanks for your reply about the installation of a valve just before the head, but isn't that what Moen says to avoid doing? Have you had anybody actually do this? witout any problems? Hube
  5. daveydo

    daveydo New Member

    Messages:
    36
    Jimbo, did Moen say why not to restrict after the valve? Isn't that what happens when a showerhead is installed? Do they specify the flow rate after the valve. i.e acceptable shower heads to be used with a Posi-temp?
  6. jimbo

    jimbo Plumber

    Messages:
    8,997
    Location:
    San Diego
    I meant to restrict after the VALVE, not ahead of the valve which is what I though the homneowner was asking.
  7. breplum

    breplum Member

    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    San Francisco Bay Area
    I love the Alsons tiny lever volume control which attaches to a shower arm.
    This kind of volume control can, when cranked down to low flow, affect the pressure balancing effect of most shower valves. That is why most mfr. will not recommend reducing the flow.

    If you don't like having the shower head lowered by the inch and a half of volume control, add an articulating arm to raise the whole thing up.
  8. LonnythePlumber

    LonnythePlumber Plumber, Contractor, Attorney

    Messages:
    319
    Location:
    Wichita, Kansas
    Flow Restrictor

    Deb's advise about reinstalling a flow restrictor in your shower head would not conflict with Moen's advise to not restrict flow. Shower heads normally come with the restrictor cutting flow down to 2.5 gallons per minute. Yours has probably been removed. Take the head off and look at the connection.
  9. Hube

    Hube New Member

    Messages:
    156
    Location:
    Ontario
    Lonnie; Thanks for your reply.
    The shower head is still intact, the restrictor has not been removed.
    In fact, the flow is only apprx 2.0 gpm (not 2.5 )
  10. LonnythePlumber

    LonnythePlumber Plumber, Contractor, Attorney

    Messages:
    319
    Location:
    Wichita, Kansas
    1 gpm

    I understand you to say that you want to cut down the amount of water from your shower head from 2 gallons per minute to 1 gallon per minute. Deb's gonna love you although I can't understand why you would want to do this. Maybe you can find a flow restrictor that only allows 1 gpm.
  11. Hube

    Hube New Member

    Messages:
    156
    Location:
    Ontario
    This then comes back to the original question: will resticting the output of the showerhead be a cause of any failure in the cartridge? (as Moen has indicated)
  12. DianaJ

    DianaJ New Member

    Messages:
    3
    Moen defective showerhead

    My plumber's worker installed a moen 82496 shower kit and after he left I found the shower head volume flow to be excessive (seemed to be over 2.5gpm). Turns out the restrictor was damaged and we replaced it with another head.
  13. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,450
    Location:
    Connecticut
    I believe I might have seen the same thread Deb is talking about... Can you imagine that a 2" drain was being over run by a 17.5 GPM multiple head shower? There should be a law...:mad:
  14. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,680
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    Moen

    There is absolutely no problem with installing a flow control valve on the shower arm, as long is is not one with a 100% shutoff so you cannot turn off the flow by closing that valve and leaving the shower control turned on.
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