Mitigating effects of oversized of Alpine 105 Mod Con boiler in small house

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David W.

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Tom, let the others on this forum speak for themselves. I promise not to "screw around" with your boiler if you promise not to mess with mine. Several of my friends are licensed, very successful plumbers and howled with laughter when I forwarded them this thread. They all said don't you have better things to do with your time?
 

Tom Sawyer

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It's NOT your boiler. Your friends are idiots just like you. What part of illegal for you to mess with don't you understand?
 
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Dana

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I'm pretty sure tweaking the outdoor reset curve does not qualify as "working on gas appliances" any more than turning the temp up/down on your gas oven would be.

Monkeying with the gas plumbing or venting, or repairing a faulty boiler ignition would be outside the legal bounds. Even swapping a thermocouple on a standing pilot ignition is a technical violation, not that anybody is going to write you up for that. Re-lighting your own standing pilot is probably pushing the envelope too, not that you'd be written up on that one either. Messing with combustion blower settings on an ALP or some of the other setup issues might be technical violations, and may have safety or longevity consequences for the boiler.

I too am curious as whether the landlord has issues with making adjustments without prior permission/discussion with both the landlord &/or a boiler tech. The whole installation is suspect, given that the installer (as reported) neglected to install the code-required tempering valve on the indirect, and the fact that they installed a 3-speed pump on the indirect loop rather than just specifying the correct single-speed, and that it was initially set at a speed that short-cycled the boiler. It wouldn't surprise me if the whole thing was a bootleg. Any inspection tags in evidence?

Anything you do that is dangerous and caused damages or ruins the equipment would be some liability issues. If the thing was installed improperly and causes harm or self-destructs that's going to be on the bond of the licensed installer. Setting the outdoor reset curves to something other than the default settings is neither dangerous or damaging to the equipment. About the worst that would happen is if you set it so low that it's short-cycling like crazy, putting a lot of wear & tear on the boiler. That's not dangerous, and sadly, many licensed-bonded professionals in MA have left boilers set up to short-cycle themselves into an early grave.

Disclaimer: I'm not practicing law in MA nor am I a MA licensed gas-fitter or plumber.
 

Tom Sawyer

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Dana, if it was his equipment, in his house then I would have no problem advising him but it's not and while the installation may indeed be suspect, he is a tenant not the owner so those issues should be handled by the landlord. As a landlord myself, if one of my tenants was messing about with any of the mechanicals in the building, I would toss his ass to the curb and keep his security deposit. Even messing with the re-set curve is not something tenants should be doing.
 

Dana

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Tom- you are making the presumption that none of it has been discussed with the landlord, while there is no evidence on this thread that he either has or hasn't. (Or did I miss something?)
 

Tom Sawyer

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Only that he gets pretty testy when I bring it up and he hasn't said anything to make me believe he has cleared it with the landlord.
 

David W.

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Ok let's put this all to rest. I believe I said the landlord owns the equipment and I do have permission to tweak the reset curves. He's going to do the same because we have identical boilers and spaces. Tom I was annoyed that you kept assuming I was a reckless outlaw without asking me the situation as it really was. You just inserted yourself rudely. Nobody is breaking any laws and all is good. Let's all go back to plumbing now.
 

Tom Sawyer

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Yea, I tend to insert myself rudely when some hack is messing with stuff he shouldn't be messing with. The fact that you refer to it as plumbing is pretty much all I need to know. Personally, I think you're full of crap and I seriously doubt like hell that your landlord is ok with you fiddling around with equipment that probably just cost him 10 grand or so. You appear to be what landlords call a tenant from hell. Just for your edification though, nothing you do with re-set curves or fan speeds is going to do jack in the way of saving you any sort of significant money. If the boiler is that much oversized, it is what it is.
 

David W.

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Thanks Tom, you can think what you want. I'm here for knowledge and not insulting people. I've held back from saying what I think of you and your unwanted advice and will leave it at that.
 

Tom Sawyer

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Say what you want but I'm the guy with the licenses. You want to learn? Take some courses. Do the apprenticeship. IOW pay your dues.
 

Mage182

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So anyway. David, could you post up pics of a few screens from the Alpine if you get a chance? A few status screens and one of the curve screens? I've heard the never revisions have better screens and more options and I'm curious to see what they are.
 

Dana

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Tweaking the reset curves isn't going to save a ton of money, but if you dial it in to where you barely need the thermostat it can do quite a bit for comfort. The marginal cost savings of getting the last 1-2% of efficiency out of it are largely eaten up by the pumping power use, but by keeping the place at a constant temperature the walls & ceiling temps (the define the radiant temperature in the room, which is a comfort issue) are as good as they can be. It'll get even better if you can cut a deal where you can squirt some cellulose into those wall cavities.

Having the thing running in a mode where it isn't short-cycling all the time also lowers the risk of it crapping out on you any time soon too.
 
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