Measuring solder

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Mikey

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While I don't mark my solder at the diameter of the pipe, I do have a rough feeling for how much solder is enough. If the joint keeps accepting solder after it's had "enough", I know something's wrong -- usually happens on vertical runs with the joint downward, and on inspection there's usually a big glob of solder that made it through the joint and eventually stopped running somewhere where the pipe was cool. In the (thankfully few) instances where it's happened to me, I usually attributed it to an ill-fitting joint (too loose, deformed pipe). Taking care during the prep work seems to be the solution.
 

Redwood

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This would be the mirror I use.

apo_t73552.jpg
 

Mikey

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That's my kind of workbench. Do you use the Hydroflux Welder for plumbing? That'll blow away the Mapp crowd for sure, and it's non-oxidizing as well!
 

Ian Gills

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Thanks Mikey. This post is attacting a lot of attention.

I do find that the use of all gasses for soldering has drawbacks. Pressurized bottles can be costly, dangerous and are prohibited in increasing numbers of municipalities and states. In addition, these gasses generally do not burn cleanly and can leave excessive oxidation and "fire scale" on the pipes and fittings. The HydroFlux Welder answers all these needs and more. The HydroFlux is an oxyhydrogen generator that operates by converting distilled water into an oxygen/hydrogen fuel gas. The HydroFlux Welder creates gas on a demand basis. This means that there is no potentially dangerous stored gas.

Because the HydroFlux Welder burns a gas that has a high hydrogen content, it produces what is referred to as a "reducing" flame. What this means is that the flame of the HydroFlux Welder will actually eliminate oxides to some extent. Because it reduces or eliminates oxidation, soldering with the HydroFlux Welder is much cleaner than what can be achieved with traditional torches. However, the reducing flame of the HydroFlux is only effective where the flame is actually in contact with the copper fitting. Because of this, I always use a flux dip prior to soldering, and a suitable flux when soldering to ensure clean, perfect joints.

It's a $1000 well spent.

I assume comments will follow........
 
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Frenchie

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You really dont know the frustration and disgust that
happens when you got an employee that wants to measure
solder........

and then wants to get into a plumbing pride and plumbing
manhood debate with you about it.....thats always fun..

presently I have an idiot that has it in his head that you dont
need more than 1/2 inch of solder fo r a 1/2 joint and 3/4 inch
solder for a 3/4 joint...and their is no talking him out of it...

he basically can solder someting just good enough to last about
untill the time they get home. and sit down to supper.....

this is actually a "talent or skill" that cant be taught....
to be able to solder a "timed released leak"....
it lasts just long enough to get out of the home ...

of course someone else has had to go behind him and
fix the mistakes later on that day or evening.
.30 miles away.... and of course it cant be his soldering abilities
it must have been a bad joint....

I have threatened to take pics of the work and dock him on
the pay check next time it happens..because I am the guy
that has to go back and fix the problems.


Solder is about 12 dollars a roll.......slop it on ,
let it drip once or twice...... then take a rag and wipe it off
all neat and clean looking..... Use the whole 12 dollar roll if you must....

gas is 4 dollars a gallon....xx how far away

my time is invaluable....

going back out that evening at midnight to fix a leak
30 miles away becasue of stupidity like this is
simply PRICELESS.



Uh, Mark?

I worked in the trades, all over, as an employee, for 15 years - I've worked for plasterers, carpenters, boatwrights, plumbers, electricians, remodelers... all kinds.

I've never worked under anyone who didn't expect me to fix my own screwups, on my own time. Never. Not once.

It's supposed to be the employee going back, on HIS own time, to fix his screwups. NOT YOU!

... ESPECIALLY if you've told him how to do it, and he's stubbornly sticking to his own way.


Look at it this way - you're depriving this guy of the opportunity to learn from his mistakes.
 

osx-addict

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Hi all.. Thought I'd chime in on this very interesting (and amusing) thread.. We had a remodel done late last year and we had to do the '3-strikes' game with our plumber.. The main portion of the plumbing was done just fine (DWV + new hot/cold lines -- all done by one guy over the course of a number of weeks).. The annoying part was when his 'other' guys came over to do the finish work -- hooking up sinks, toilets, showers, etc.. Below are a few of the odd problems I had over the course of a single week :

  1. Toilet installation -- I've done it a bunch of times and have learned to take my time and do it right.. These guys came in, hooked them up OK but left two in a rocking condition on a tile floor. All 3 of them had toilet bolts longer than wanted so the caps couldnt be properly installed.. They had cut the bolts but cut them too long.. Sloppy work! More than likely I'll have to re-do some of this sloppy work -- when I've got some spare time..
  2. Hot/cold water valve installation (removing the plugs on the new lines) -- the guy doing this task (by himself) cut off all plugs, installed all valves and left them all open and then proceeded to turn the water main back on.. :confused: He then did a half-assed cleanup of the pools of water and left, leaving the real cleanup to me.. I was furious as he had left pools of water in our brand-new installed cabinets, all over the tile floors, etc..
  3. Same guy that did the 'work' above (flood) was tasked with re-installing our old gas water heater. It took the guy about 4 hours to do it since he spent probably 3 1/2 hours talking on the phone.. Needless to say his concentration was not there and the job was fairly sloppy (I could have done a better job).
Needless to say, there were other issues that occurred later when it was time to install faucets & showers and we told our contractor that he had to 'go'.. The contractor was so annoyed with this 'sub' of his that he no longer uses him.. Oh well..
 

Master Plumber Mark

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forgot to mention its all family

Uh, Mark?


Look at it this way - you're depriving this guy of the opportunity to learn from his mistakes.


Thank you for the advice......

but in my situation its all family...
and German on top of that....


I am not depriveing anyone out of any opprtunity
because a dumb dutchman can never
admit they are wrong even when it is
spraying them in the face...
 
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NovicePiper

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me thinks master plumber mark is a comic on the weekends - seriously though ive done a little bit of plumbing etc and my pipes seem ok after around 6 wks - not secured them yet so they sway a little when pressured up - waiting for the plumber to come in and check what ive done is correct - what do you think the chances will be of them being ok? im not the tidy type of pipe sweater but ive done well over 100 joints (on the last 3 jobs i did fro myself) and no leaks as yet. i can see what he means when he says he's not likning the solder runs, personally i have total respect for plumbers. i get bored after about the tenth solder joint.
 

Ian Gills

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Hydroflux welder anyone?

It appears that measuring solder is becoming almost as popular as where can I get a Bradford to install myelf?
 

Redwood

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Now you've just started a whole new dimension as the thread turns to "My Elf."

Everyone should have there own personal Elf! LOL
 

Breplum

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FYI presoldered are fine too

I have been buying and using presoldered fittlings from http://www.presolderedfittings.com and have been very pleased with the price and results. They are actually cheaper (at least as long as they do free shipping with no minimums) and very easy to use.

It is kind of strange to do soldering without a roll of solder in your hand, but it is so easy and fun.

We follow up every solder joint with NoKorode regular flux while still warm, to brighetn up the joint before washing and wiping...looks better and helps remove the water-flux residue as well.
 

Redwood

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Geez You should have been at Big Orange Box when they clearanced those handyman gimmicks off their shelves a year or 2 ago to make room for the sharkbites! I guess even the handyman types weren't willing to pay the extra $$ for them!
 

TorontoTim

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I used so much solder on an overhead joint in my basement that a giant blob fell on my forearm and stuck there. About 1" x 1" on my arm.

I have a nice solder-shaped scar on my arm to remind me of my plumbing efforts. Everytime my wife gets on my back about something I just point to the scar to remind her of my sacrifice for her finished basement.
 

TorontoTim

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Hi all.. Thought I'd chime in on this very interesting (and amusing) thread.. We had a remodel done late last year and we had to do the '3-strikes' game with our plumber.. The main portion of the plumbing was done just fine (DWV + new hot/cold lines -- all done by one guy over the course of a number of weeks).. The annoying part was when his 'other' guys came over to do the finish work -- hooking up sinks, toilets, showers, etc.. Below are a few of the odd problems I had over the course of a single week :

  1. Toilet installation -- I've done it a bunch of times and have learned to take my time and do it right.. These guys came in, hooked them up OK but left two in a rocking condition on a tile floor. All 3 of them had toilet bolts longer than wanted so the caps couldnt be properly installed.. They had cut the bolts but cut them too long.. Sloppy work! More than likely I'll have to re-do some of this sloppy work -- when I've got some spare time..
  2. Hot/cold water valve installation (removing the plugs on the new lines) -- the guy doing this task (by himself) cut off all plugs, installed all valves and left them all open and then proceeded to turn the water main back on.. :confused: He then did a half-assed cleanup of the pools of water and left, leaving the real cleanup to me.. I was furious as he had left pools of water in our brand-new installed cabinets, all over the tile floors, etc..
  3. Same guy that did the 'work' above (flood) was tasked with re-installing our old gas water heater. It took the guy about 4 hours to do it since he spent probably 3 1/2 hours talking on the phone.. Needless to say his concentration was not there and the job was fairly sloppy (I could have done a better job).
Needless to say, there were other issues that occurred later when it was time to install faucets & showers and we told our contractor that he had to 'go'.. The contractor was so annoyed with this 'sub' of his that he no longer uses him.. Oh well..

Uh, how did the guy in problem #2 get tasked with installling your water heater? Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice... don't get fooled again (to quote the venerable GWB).
 
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