Kinetico flooding

Discussion in 'Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and r' started by phoebe, Aug 9, 2010.

  1. phoebe

    phoebe New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    UK
    Hi -

    I have a kinetico block salt softener about 12 y o. I currently have it isolated, as it recently flooded the kitchen. There is no obvious blockage in the overflow and water does drip through it, but when the machine is not isolated, water is flowing into the reserve tank at full pressure causing the water level inside to rise and rise until it floods over the top of where i put the salt in. I have tried trying to get it to manually regenerate, but it does not. The other thing that may be worth a mention is that, whilst investigating this problem, I have noticed that the open/close valves on the pipes to the machine leak when open.

    I have tried my local service engineers, but am waiting since Friday for a call back - any ideas please?
  2. Skip Wolverton

    Skip Wolverton In the Trades

    Messages:
    167
    Location:
    Ocala, Fl
    The float assemble stops the water from flowing into the salt tank. Pull the float out of the salt tank and clean. Pulling up on the center rod should stop the water flow.
  3. phoebe

    phoebe New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    UK
    thank you, i have tried removing and cleaning the float assembly. I replaced in the machine, and turned the water back on............. in doing so, I think i have discovered the problem. There is a split in the high pressure hose between the float assembly and the machine; could this be the reason that the machine will not manually regenerate also??? Could it be that there is not enough water pressure to get it to do so? And finally, do i need a kinetico specialist to replace it, or could a plumber do the job?

    Thank you for your assistance ;-)
  4. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,814
    Location:
    New England
    Kinetico is sometimes very fussy about who they will sell parts to, so, even if you could fix it, you may not be able to get the parts. Not sure if this is generic.
  5. Skip Wolverton

    Skip Wolverton In the Trades

    Messages:
    167
    Location:
    Ocala, Fl
    If it's the hose that is split, you can replace it. It's a standard 3/8" high density tubing. If the split is close enough to a connection, just cut out the bad part for a quick fix and replace soon.
  6. phoebe

    phoebe New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    UK
    Thanks again - could you comment on whether the split would account for the machine not regenerating?
  7. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Being non electric and with the serious water leak reducing water pressure, the control valve may not have enough pressure to regenerate. Fix the leak and it probably will regenerate.
  8. phoebe

    phoebe New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    UK
    I am missing my softened water and cant afford £70+vat + parts call out fee. I can often fix things by myself ........ fingers crossed!!
  9. big dripper

    big dripper New Member

    Messages:
    71
    Location:
    Ohio
    Is the split on a hard plastic line or a flexible line. 3/8", 1/4"? What is the model number. You said you use a 'block salt type" unit? How big are these blocks (-+ 1/3 stone)?
  10. Skip Wolverton

    Skip Wolverton In the Trades

    Messages:
    167
    Location:
    Ocala, Fl
    The crack in the hose will not prevent the unit to going thru a regen, but will cause it not to draw brine which will result in hard water.
  11. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Really. How do you know that the leak isn't big enough to rob enough pressure to cause the water powered control valve to not be able to move the valving? Or, that the water flowing to the leak isn't preventing the valve from moving?
  12. big dripper

    big dripper New Member

    Messages:
    71
    Location:
    Ohio
    I wonder what your incoming pressure is? If the excessive pressure caused both leaks, then a pressure suppressor/regulator may be needed. Check what maximum pressure is permitted with the softener and what is coming in your home.

  13. Skip Wolverton

    Skip Wolverton In the Trades

    Messages:
    167
    Location:
    Ocala, Fl
    We're talking about a 3/8 line vs a 3/4 or even 1"inlet/outlet. There is no way for a 3/8 line to rob enough water to prevent the unit from starting a regen. If that were the case, anytime the unit was in a fill cycle, the customer would not have water flow in the home.
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2010
  14. phoebe

    phoebe New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    UK
    THank you for your help guys - I had to give in and call an engineer and am now £150 poorer.
    The hose was split, and the fact that it was and that the vacuum was not maintained after the overflow caused the machine to not regenerate ????
    Anyway - all fixed - hopefully I will be enjoying softened water again soon.

    Thanks again
    Phoebe x

    Oh - and the water pressure in the daytime at the outside tap was 95 - he recommended that I fit a pressure control valve....... but wants a further £150..... not much chance of that then!!
  15. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    21,814
    Location:
    New England
    Take note that daytime pressures are usually LOWER than nighttime peak pressures. At least in the US, a regulator is required when the pressure exceeds 80#. If you do add one, you will probably also need an expansion tank (assuming you have a tank type heater, which you may not), to prevent the water pressure rising while the water heater raises the temperature and the water expands. A PRV makes the system 'closed' in that that expansion can't be passed back to the mains.
  16. big dripper

    big dripper New Member

    Messages:
    71
    Location:
    Ohio
    Which hose was it? Can you describe it? Could you have replaced yourself?
  17. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Andy, she said it was the brine line that was split on her Kinetico softener and it wouldn't regenerate.
  18. nhmaster3015

    nhmaster3015 Master Plumber

    Messages:
    836
    Location:
    The granite state
    That is just way too funny :) Just like being back in high school all over again
  19. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Yeah I couldn't figure out how he couldn't remember what she had said before, especially (IIRC) when he had asked her about what "hose" before and she answered him... Maybe he didn't graduate.
  20. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    As we see now the split prevented the regeneration as I said was possible and you said it wouldn't;

    *************
    The hose was split, and the fact that it was and that the vacuum was not maintained after the overflow caused the machine to not regenerate
    **********
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