Jet pump help

[Nick.bedard]

Hi, hope someone can help me. Our house water is fed from a dugout, when summer hits our filters plug up faster then usual with dirt. We think its the muskrat causing the issue. But recently our pump died on us. It would take a long time to build pressure then would cut in and out enough times to blow the breaker, but now its totally dead. So we replaced it with a new 3/4 convertible pump (same kind as what was in it previous just different brand). The new pump does the same thing now. The pumps pressure switch is set for 20/50. When it finally hits 50 after about 10 minutes of trying it keeps turning off and on non stop. When looking at the gauge while it happens i see that it is going between 20 and 50 psi each time.
We have checked the pressure tank and it was low so we topped it up to 18 psi. We have changed the filters not to long ago before the pump died. If i close the line just after the pressure tank the pump still takes for ever yo build pressure.
If i turn off the water just after the pump (4 feet) it still does the cut in and out very fast non stop.
Any help would be greatly appreciated
We have tried to locate the foot valve in thw dug out but couldn't find it. Will try looking again tomorrow
Thanks for the help

 

[Craigpump]

Muskrat?

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Nick.bedard]

Muskrat?

Yea he digs around and tunnels around our dugout. Cute little guy but has to go

 

[Reach4]

I think you are saying that you have a dug well. Is it about 40 inches diameter and 12 ft deep? Then you have a single steel pipe that goes into the well and the bottom of the pipe is about 3 ft off of the bottom or what? And when the muskrat(s) swim around, that stirs up the mud and partially blocks the foot valve. Also the foot valve gets held partially open, by debris maybe, and water flows back down out of the pressure tank when the pump stops running. Is that roughly what you are describing?

We have tried to locate the foot valve in thw dug out but couldn't find it. Will try looking again tomorrow

The foot valve goes on the end of the pipe. If you pull the pipe, you should see the foot valve to clean replace it. If you do have steel pipe, I would replace that with PVC.

You maybe will need to dig your well deeper if sediment has filled in much of the well.

 

[Nick.bedard]

No there is no well. House is fed completely by a dugout.
And the line is pvc up to the house

 

[Reach4]

No there is no well. House is fed completely by a dugout.

You don't say.

 

[Nick.bedard]

You don't say.

?

 

[Craigpump]

Define dug out.

You do know that cute little muskrat has more than likely contaminated your water supply with his waste. Right?

 

[Reach4]

You don't describe your ****: width, depth, slope. You might want to look up well. You might want to look up dugout in a dictionary. You don't say how far the bottom of your drop pipe is above the bottom. You don't indicate how you could lose your foot valve when it should be attached to the bottom of your drop pipe. "You don't say" had a double meaning.

You did say your drop pipe was PVC. That is good. And you said you don't have a well. Well?

Put a fine wire fence around your **** and bury the bottom deep enough to discourage trying to dig under.

You may need to dig your hole, that was dug to access ground water from the water table, deeper to clear out the sediment.

 

[Nick.bedard]

We dont use the water for drinking it is only used for the cleaning.

There is no drop pipe in a dugout hence why i never said how i cant find the foot valve on the end.

From what i can assume its the pvc line going into our dugout and the foot valve is on the end, but we cant find the line in the dugout. We found a rope that we assumed was attached to the line at one point but that rope is rotted off. We have walked the dugout up to my chest trying to locate the line to find the end but have not found

I do know the difference between a well and a dugout, Hence why i said dugout. I have included a picture of my dugout. If it doesnt load just go to Google and search water dugout. Not trying to sound rude but its been 3 days now with no water and im trying to get this crap working

 

[Nick.bedard]

Define dug out.

You do know that cute little muskrat has more than likely contaminated your water supply with his waste. Right?

Yea i do and he will be leaving very shortly. Havent seen him for awhile, we are going to get rid of him next time he surfaces

 

[Reach4]

I do know the difference between a well and a dugout, Hence why i said dugout. I have included a picture of my dugout. If it doesnt load just go to Google and search water dugout. Not trying to sound rude but its been 3 days now with no water and im trying to get this crap working

That looks like a pond. What feeds water to it?

I did Google "water dugout". I did find pictures similar to yours. Now I understand. It seems to be a Canadian term. Are you in Canada? You didn't say. That does make it more likely that your pipe would be buried than if you were in Florida. Did you Google "dugout" by chance? I did. Did you check a dictionary for "dugout". I did.

You have a pipe going from your pump to the water to be pumped. I think you are saying that that pipe is buried and you cannot find where it enters the water....

 

[Nick.bedard]

That looks like a pond. What feeds water to it?

I did Google "water dugout". It seems to be a Canadian term.Are you in Canada? You didn't say. Did you Google "dugout" by chance? I did. Did you check a dictionary for "dugout". I did.

You have a pipe going from your pump to the water to be pumped. I think you are saying that that pipe is buried and you cannot find where it enters the water....

Yes sorry im from canada. Did not realise it was a candian term.
It is fed by rain and other nature ways plus i have another dugout farther back to pump into it if it gets to low.
But yes i cant find the line to locate the foot valve.

When i turn off the water after the pump to isolate it to the dugout and pump only it still just turns on and off rapidly.

The pressure in the system now is 30 psi and when i turn the pump on it will slowly try to kick in.( i let the system build some pressure then turn the pump off to save it from burning out)

So im wondering if it could be the foot valve causing this issue or could the pump be faulty?

The old pump did this same thing with turning off and on rapidly but only 3 or 4 times then would be fine but would take along time to build up to the shut off pressure like how this one is now

 

[Reach4]

Not being able to draw much water when the pump runs sounds like clogging. Having the built-up pressure drop off sounds like the check valve in the foot valve is failing to stop the water from draining back.

I think you are going to have to go wading. You may need to get the excavator back to remove more material if you cannot raise the intake enough to not suck stuff from the bottom while not getting into the area that freezes. If this body of water is lined, perhaps you could use an air lift pump to suck sediment from the area around your pickup.

When i turn off the water after the pump to isolate it to the dugout and pump only it still just turns on and off rapidly.

The pressure in the system now is 30 psi and when i turn the pump on it will slowly try to kick in.( i let the system build some pressure then turn the pump off to save it from burning out)

So im wondering if it could be the foot valve causing this issue or could the pump be faulty?

The old pump did this same thing with turning off and on rapidly but only 3 or 4 times then would be fine but would take along time to build up to the shut off pressure like how this one is now

Usually turning on and off rapidly sounds like a bad pressure tank. But you found that you have air precharge when the water pressure is zero, so that would indicate that you don't have a bad pressure tank. So maybe with the information, somebody will be able to figure out a cause and cure for your rapid initial cycling. You could try holding the pressure switch on manually (push the armature of the pressure switch with an insulator such as a stick of dry wood). Then watch the pressure gauge action.

 

[Boycedrilling]

Sounds like your check valve in your pond is not closing all the way and the pressurized water is just going back out it when the pump shuts off. When the pressure drops, the pump kicks back on, and off, and on........

Plumb an air compressor into your suction line to the pond. The air bubbles will tell you where the foot valve is in the pond. It's probably down into some mud and needs to be cleaned and raised off the bottom

 

[Nick.bedard]

Thanks will have to try that. Just checked again and our5 micron filter was plugged solid of mud. Replaced it and ran it again and 15 min later it was plugged again. Am thinking the end probably is in the mud

 

[Texas Wellman]

Yep, your line is buried in mud, which is not only keeping the footvalve stuck open but plugging the lines with mud. Boyce had an excellent idea about pushing air to find the line. It may also clear the mud away.

 

[Nick.bedard]

We tried blowing air back down the line and had bout 50 psi in it and didnt show nothing outside

 

[Smooky]

If it was mine, I would build a little well house next to the pond. All you need is a shallow well pump. Connect it to a pipe with some well screen on the end and set it up so it will stay deep enough not to freeze and high enough to keep any fine mud out.

 

[Valveman]

If you can't find the footvalve, just connect a new check valve to the suction side of the pump. If the line stays primed it might work like it does in a point well.