Is this valve easy to replace? Pic inside...

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice' started by pghsebring, Oct 8, 2009.

  1. pghsebring

    pghsebring DIY Member

    Messages:
    97
    Location:
    Ohio
    [​IMG]

    I want to know if this is just a screw off, screw back on type of deal...will i be able to get the new nut over the main line, or is it too flared in there? Would it have to be reflared with a tool or anything? What kind of tool if so?

    Is that just a short piece of galvinized between the valve and the meter? Is that another flare into the water meter? Or is that a special little piece i'm going to have to get somewhere?

    I found the valve, its a nibco 577-17...now i just have to locate one. It used to be leaking pretty good, the water company repacked it and said "good luck", now it only leaks a little...they don't seem to be too interested in their lost water...i guess they figure i'll be more pissed when my house is destroyed...
  2. johnjh2o1

    johnjh2o1 Plumbing Contractor for 49 years

    Messages:
    1,143
    Location:
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    That is a flared valve . You will have to use the existing nut on your new valve. On the meter side that is what is called a meter spud. It's made of brass and there is a washer between the spud and the meter. Not sure where you are located but in most towns the water company is responsible for every thing before the meter.

    John
  3. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    27,251
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    valve

    It will be easy to "replace" in terms of the time and effort to install it. FINDING one however may be a different matter. To give you an idea of how difficult it could be, I have NEVER even seen that valve in 55+ years, either installed at a meter or on the supply house shelves. Part of the problem is that it is a "Water meter valve" and normally the only ones who would need or use one would be the water utility companies, because, as previously mentioned, that part of the system is typically their responsibility. The reason they are usually responsible for it is, as you mentioned, that any leak in that area does not pass through the meter, so it is "lost water", and since the customer is not paying for it there is no reason for him to worry about, or repair, leaks in that area.
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2009
  4. nhmaster

    nhmaster Master Plumber

    Messages:
    3,189
    Location:
    S. Maine
    Think I would cut the pipe as close to the nut as possible and replace the valve with a compression ball valve.
  5. Ian Gills

    Ian Gills Senior Robin Hood Guy

    Messages:
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    Location:
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    In my area that would be my responsibility because the water company's responsibility ends at the curb stop.

    I would get a plumber to cut the pipe and solder on a ball valve.

    I would not do it myself for two reasons.

    First, turning the water off to the house at the curb stop may not actually turn your water off which will cause trouble if you find that out only after removing the valve.

    Secondly, once cut there will not be much pipe to work with coming through the wall.
  6. nhmaster

    nhmaster Master Plumber

    Messages:
    3,189
    Location:
    S. Maine
    And that's why I would use a compression stop. Getting the water off and drained can be a real bear. If you had the use of a pro-press that would work even better
  7. pghsebring

    pghsebring DIY Member

    Messages:
    97
    Location:
    Ohio
    Wow...i didn't know it would be that rare...i could find a part number for it at least...i'll have to call all the nibco distributors to see if someone has it somehow...

    Our water company said on the website it says "Installation of New Ball Valve Before the Meter: Price of Ball Valve Plus $20.00 Service Charge" - so i called them, they came out, took one look at it and said "we don't have that valve...good luck." They literally won't do shit about it - and if it finally goes and water is pouring in my basement, they'd just shut my water off until its fixed, and i'd have to call a plumber and pay him to do it in an emergency. So i'm trying to be proactive about this.

    I didn't look closely, but is my supply line most likely copper or galvinized? Its hard to get at it with all that crap on it... If its copper, how different would it be than doing all the other valves i've replaced? Wouldn't i just solder on a valve like normal? I understand i could run into complications...but i'd call the water company to shut the line off, and if they can't, it'll be their problem to tear up my yard and fix the outside stop themselves, so i don't really care...i'll have a hose ready to divert any water right down the drain.

    Anyone recomend a specific part number to replace it with, or a link to one? Will any 3/4" angle stop work? I'd prefer to solder one on instead of using a compression one... I could put a ball valve in there, right? Its a 3/4" line i believe...
  8. Cass

    Cass Plumber

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    5,980
    Location:
    Ohio
    They are avaliable here if you can't find one there...Ferguson can get them if there is one near you....
  9. Cass

    Cass Plumber

    Messages:
    5,980
    Location:
    Ohio
    Copper...if it was galvy it would have been threaded on...
  10. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    27,251
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    valve

    The pipe is copper, the valve is flared. DO NOT convert to a compression valve. And to use ProPress you would have to do a lot of repiping to fit the pieces into that small of an area. Most companies, such as Nibco, do not take orders for one valve. They sell by the boxes, and if Ferguson ordered a box of them they would have all the rest on their shelf till the next century mark.
  11. Runs with bison

    Runs with bison Member

    Messages:
    897
    Location:
    Midwest
    The OP needs to complain up the food chain about the city not replacing their valve if he wants them to take care of it. Put the problem on the desk of the city utility director/city manager and attitudes will change. Mention that if they don't fulfill their responsibilities you will show up for public comments at the next council meeting.
  12. Cass

    Cass Plumber

    Messages:
    5,980
    Location:
    Ohio
    The citys responsibility is normaly from the main to the curb stop or meter, which ever comes first...they might give you the valve if they have one ....
  13. Ian Gills

    Ian Gills Senior Robin Hood Guy

    Messages:
    2,777
    Location:
    USA
    I always DIY but for main valves I always call a plumber.

    You really must with this one. He'll craft something up for you using an ordinary valve and fashioning the pipe that comes out of that to link up to the water meter. Perhaps.
  14. 87vertgt

    87vertgt New Member

    Messages:
    52
    Location:
    Chicago,IL
    question?

    whats the brown wire on top thats held down by the 2 screws????
  15. johnjh2o1

    johnjh2o1 Plumbing Contractor for 49 years

    Messages:
    1,143
    Location:
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    That's a seal so the water company can tell if the meter has been removed.

    John
  16. 87vertgt

    87vertgt New Member

    Messages:
    52
    Location:
    Chicago,IL
    interesting....
  17. johnjh2o1

    johnjh2o1 Plumbing Contractor for 49 years

    Messages:
    1,143
    Location:
    South*East
    Sorry I misread your post. The wire with the two screws is a ground wire. The wire attached to the nut on the meter is the seal.

    John
  18. 87vertgt

    87vertgt New Member

    Messages:
    52
    Location:
    Chicago,IL
    ok...so theres a electrically ground wire connected to the valve? why?????? thats normal?
  19. Ian Gills

    Ian Gills Senior Robin Hood Guy

    Messages:
    2,777
    Location:
    USA
    Yes, water meters should be jumpered. That' so when the water meter is removed for servicing, like when this valve will be changed, there is continuity to ground in the water pipe system.

    A few plumbers have been shocked when removing meters that were not jumpered. Especially if next door has a bad neutral and everyone's on copper pipe.

    Seals can be tampered with. My father-in-law (a retired electrican) often uses a needle to carefully unthread them when doing electrical work he's not supposed to, before threading them back up again.
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2009
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