iron problems

Discussion in 'Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and r' started by rihorton, Apr 1, 2010.

  1. rihorton

    rihorton New Member

    Messages:
    22
    Location:
    north carolina
    Oh man, this site is great, i making sure she has a good supply of them before I leave and have taught her how to replace them, actually she changes it every week, i learned that it may be best that she know how, just so the old plumber want have a chance to service anything while I am gone.
    Getting back to the old plumber, think he has changed his mind, I showed him a glass of what was coming straight out of the tank with no cartridge filter and then showed him what it look like now, and believe it or not, he said he might should do his well even though he has a what he refers to as a 2000 filter system, that you can tell he is proud of.
    What really made hime change I mind was when i asked what did his pump look like that he changes out a few weeks ago and he said, yea, you right, it was coated with iron.
  2. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Shocking a well is at best a temporary 'fix'. And it can cause serious problems with the pump, the drop pipe, the power cable, the water quality etc.. So it should not be done very frequently because it can actually make a bacteria problem worse because they will cause incrustations that chlorine can not penetrate. Thne you get into well cleaning and rehabilitation if you can find anyone to do it and have the money to do it.
  3. Skip Wolverton

    Skip Wolverton In the Trades

    Messages:
    167
    Location:
    Ocala, Fl
    rihorton
    I think your problem is more on the sediment side than the iron. I have a friend the lives in Waxsaw, NC. He has the red dirt that I believe you are talking about. The filter you are changing out should last longer with .28 iron than yours is. You may want to investigate an auto sediment filter more than an iron filter.
  4. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    This information is simply wrong. The poster clearly doesn't understand electric motors and what contributes to heat build up in the motors. Well pump motors are designed for continuous operation and there is no need for an off time for "proper cooling of the motor before the pump starts again".

    However there is a minimum recommended run time for a well pump. Because of the high starting currents associated with electric motors it is recommended that well pump motors should run a minimum of one minute to dissipate heat build up from starting current.
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2010
  5. rihorton

    rihorton New Member

    Messages:
    22
    Location:
    north carolina
    Thanks for reply, I thought it was as well, but now only using a cheap chartridge filter that I got at Lowes since doing the chlorine shock treatment, and after using it yesterday and even watering a area about 150 ft long and 8 ft wide for about and hour with the cartridge filter in, the filter is only a slight brown color and the back of the toilets which turned brown after the chlorine was done are not clear and the walls white, they where reddish orange, but after the chlorine all of the red had turned brown and appeared to look like fine brown sand, which from what I can tell is what I have read on this site and others happens to the Iron after it has been shocked with the chlorine.
  6. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,484
    Location:
    Alaska
    What lab or test has the iron at the .28ppm?

    Some thing does not sound right ... that low of iron should not be causing so many challenges.

    The total number of starts on a pump what is getting talked about, normally for a home that topic does not come up, it is more for light and heavy commerical usage of the pump.
  7. rihorton

    rihorton New Member

    Messages:
    22
    Location:
    north carolina
    I went to the local plumbing supply and got a kit to send off a sample of my water and it was sent to CUNO and the results came back as
    Iron .28 PPM.
    The questions about the on/off time was something that I asked because I was curious about how often you would expect to hear the pump cycle on/off because I do not know.
    The only thing I can think of is that the iron had gone untreated for as long as I have lived here (27 years). Still looking into the gettting a iron filter, not sure how long the shock treatment will last, but as of now the water is as clear as i can ever remember seeing it with just a cartridge filter.
  8. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,484
    Location:
    Alaska
    Even if the Iron has always been at the .28ppm for all this time, there should not have been the challenge as large as it is...

    I would find another test ... box store might have a little kit that has iron and hardness and ph in it..

    I know any number of people that use a filter to remove or reduce the iron that they have, but they are using a filter that is 4"X10" or 2 like that with a coupler, or even a 4"x20" often the filter housing is called a Big Blue..

    For me there is just some thing not right with that number of .28ppm and the challenges that you are talking about or seeing... they are not fitting...
  9. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    A possibility is that the iron test is resonably accurate but that there is also a silt problem. I think this is what Skip is suggesting. In any event I think the poster should take action to treat the acid water. A calcite AN filter will effectively remove a fair amount of silt, it will help with iron, and it will neutralize the acidic water. As you suggested early in the thread the poster then can reevaluate after operating the system for a period of time with the AN filter in place to see if further treatment is necessary.

    If there is both silt and iron then the backwash setup and frequency will be very important.
  10. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Originally Posted by Gary Slusser As long as the pump, assuming under 1.5 hp, stays off for 60 seconds for proper cooling of the motor before the pump starts again, you're fine.


    Bob, are you saying that shutting off a pump doesn't cool it?

    Starting the pump causes heat build up. Historically pump manufactures have called for pumps up to 1.5 hp to be on or off for a minimum of 60 seconds before they are started again. This minimum time is used to size well pressure tanks so that the tank's draw down gallons are sufficient to provide that minimum 60 seconds off or on between pump starts. All pump manufacturers say that frequent starts are the prime killer of pump motors.

    Correct me if I'm wrong but I think starting a motor builds heat and running that motor also builds heat, especially when the motor has no air or water flow through or past it.

    And the only way for complete cooling is to shut the motor off until it cools down to the temp of the air or water around it.
  11. rihorton

    rihorton New Member

    Messages:
    22
    Location:
    north carolina
    Thanks for advice, I have seen some big blue cartridge type filters at Lowes. Would this be what you are referring to? What kind of filter are the folks you know using? What i have would be referred to as a standard size cartridge filter.
  12. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,484
    Location:
    Alaska
    This is what I am taking about ..

    It is big,, when used there should be a bracket to hold it both to the wall and from falling or taking down the plumbing.

    Attached Files:

  13. rihorton

    rihorton New Member

    Messages:
    22
    Location:
    north carolina
    Thanks, going to go to lowes when i get back home and get one of the water test kits they have.
    If I remember correctly, I took my water test sample from my kitchen sink which is after the whole house cartridge filter that I have.
    In the big blue like what you poste, do you know which filter the folks you know use.
  14. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,484
    Location:
    Alaska
    I have customers that have 50 mircon, and then there are some that have 5 mircon....

    I would say start at any given mircon and see how that does, if it filters or no filtering, if it loads fast or slow...

    I normally start at 5mircon and go from there..
  15. rihorton

    rihorton New Member

    Messages:
    22
    Location:
    north carolina
    http://www.water-softeners-filters.com/rffe20bb-iron-filter-cartridge.html

    just did a search and saw this, have any idea how long it would take before you would have to change it?
    I know its not as good as a self cleaning type, but the city has extended the water to about a 1/2 mile from my house and the talk is that they are going to extend it to where I live in the next year, so thinking this might be better than spending a couple of thousand dollars since I will then be able to get on the city water and not have to have the filter system then.
    Thanks
  16. Akpsdvan

    Akpsdvan In the Trades

    Messages:
    1,484
    Location:
    Alaska
    The filters that you are using right now are what micron and last how long?

    Going from the 2x10 to the 4x10 will give more time between changings...

    Often the 4x10 are going for 10-15 per.... maybe a little more or a little less.... if you use 2 every 5 months that is what maybe 30.00? or 75 every 5 months?

    Even Pentek will not say how many gallons will pass before it is loaded,, just that it can handle up to 3ppm or iron but for how long???? who knows,,, they don't have it listed..
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