Installing a toilet AFTER installing the tile

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by atroutcatcher, Sep 5, 2007.

  1. atroutcatcher

    atroutcatcher New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    Colorado
    Greetings everyone!

    I've recently performed my first tile installation in one of my bathrooms and it's time to reinstall the toilet.

    I did my best to read about this, but have apparently missed something...amateurs!

    With that, the toilet flange (I think) was screwed into the floor and was glued to the existing plumbing. I attempted removal of the flange so that I could install new subflooring underneath it, but no luck (as mentioned, it was glued).

    Now I have the tile installed and left the flange in it's original position (screwed to the existing subfloor). Now it's approximately 7/8 inches (after the tile, hardibacker and such were installed).

    I attempted looking through the forums for similar dilemmas, but cannot find anything to match my challenge.

    So, any advice on what to do now? Is there an 'extension' i can install on the existing flange to bring it up to the tile level?

    Thanks everyone!
  2. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,351
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    The right way is to remove the flange. Since you say it is glued, I will assume it is either PVC or ABS. In either case, the flange can be cut out with a special tool, but you will still have that 7/8" to make up. My advise is to have a professional do it. He will have the tools, and knowledge to do the job right.
  3. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,053
    Location:
    New England
    Ideally, the flange would sit on TOP of the finished floor. While not ideal, you may get by with flange extenders that get caulked and screwed to the original to raise it above the finished floor surface where it should be.
  4. jimbo

    jimbo Plumber

    Messages:
    8,997
    Location:
    San Diego
    Flange extenders are 1/4" thick spacers which you can stack up on top of the flange, using silicone in between, and long bolts. Another alternative is the so-called waxless rings, from Fluidmaster and Rectorseal. They were designed for just this situation, and accomodate at least an inch and a half too low on the flange.
  5. frenchie

    frenchie Jack of all trades

    Troutcatcher, you need to change that avatar, it's too much like HJ's.

    No disrespect to Jimbo or Jadnashua, but IMHO Gary had it right. That many spacers would be... risky.
  6. atroutcatcher

    atroutcatcher New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    Colorado
    Thanks for the quick advice.

    Since this toilet/wc is on the second floor in my home, I will call some of the local professionals to get a quote. I'm not so sure about the process anyway and will watch what they do so I can learn the process for the next time (I have another bathroom to do next week!).

    If the quote is too terribly high, I will pursue the other recommendations (very appreciative for the input!).

    By the way, do you guys happen to know if there is a 'ball park' price I should expect on the installation? I live in the mountains and know the labor will be higher than other parts of the country.

    If you guys happen to have pictures of the items you are suggesting, that would be great too.
  7. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,351
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    I'm not saying that stacking spacers won't work. I am suggesting the the right way is to replace the flange and set the new one properly. Spacers might work just fine or they might not. I would use them, but that's me.
  8. tonykarns

    tonykarns In the Trades

    Messages:
    82
    Location:
    wisconsin
    tool costs $90.00

    The tool for internal cutting of your PVC costs $90.00. Just have the plumber come in and do the cut for you, purchase the parts ahead of time and have him put them in while he is there.

    tony
  9. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,053
    Location:
    New England
    The problem you have now is that you tiled up to the flange. When you raise it, you will need to make some sort of support for it. The lip of the flange should cover the finished floor, but in your case, you stopped it at the outer edge. You may need to make a donut of plywood or maybe even stuff some mortar or something underneath the lip of the new flange to provide support. The flange anchors the toilet, and therefore needs to be anchored well itself.

    As was said, the right way would have been to have removed it, tiled up to the riser with enough room to install the flange, then install the flange so it was fully supported by the finished floor; then, anchored through it into the subflooring. Retrofitting still requires the flange to be supported. Sometimes you have to get creative.
  10. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,684
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    tonykarns

    And just how is he to know which are the right parts to buy? My worst jobs are trying to make something that the customer bought, because the aisleman said it would work, fit the application. Sometimes it is cheaper to pay the plumber his price for his parts.
  11. Old Dog

    Old Dog G.C. 22+ years(in 3 states)

    Messages:
    82
    Location:
    Hawaii
    Education...

    Pay a good plumber his price to fix your problem.Remember you are not just paying for his time but his expertise to fix the problem that you created.Ask him if you can watch him fix it.That education is worth every dollar that you spend so you can learn from the mistake you made.
    This is not a rip on you so please don't take it that way.You may be able to do the work on the next bathroom.At the very least you can get the plumber to fix the other bathroom before you tile .That should save you a little money on the service call...

    Had to come back to add this.If you fix it yourself and it leaks,you will have to fix a damaged ceiling along with getting a plumber to redo it.Something else to consider...
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2007
  12. PEW

    PEW DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    487
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