I received my water test, what does it mean?

[adayrider]

I can't figure out how to post it. Says its to big of a file.

 

[adayrider]

try this

 

[Sponsor]

 

[adayrider]

there we go.
Ok, 3 people live here, 2 full baths, and the usual appliances no super showers or big tubs.
Everything is new- pump, well, house, everything.
I have an old fleck 9000 from old house about 15 years old but only thing worth keeping is the valve body and tanks. rebuilding it seems to be as much as buying a new 7000 sxt complete. And not sure how to program the old 9000 compared to new digital 7000 where you just plug in the numbers. But will not rule out 9000 if thats what is advised. I also have an old 2500 pot/perm that I am using till I get everthing I need to fix it right to help keep iron stains down and sulfer smell down. I am planning to rebuild the 2500 and using it unless advised in different direction.
Need anymore info just ask.
Thanks in advance

 

[Reach4]

Your water looks very good, from what I can see. Pot Perm? Are you saying that the water test you posted is not a test of your raw water, but might be a sample taken after you have gone through some treatment already? That must be the case.

If so, that is certainly OK. It still reflects what the softener will see. Plugging your numbers into http://www.qualitywaterassociates.com/sizing.php , it says you should have a 1 cubic ft or bigger softener. Considering SFR and efficiency, I think you would want to go 1.5 or 2.0 cubic ft.

 

[adayrider]

No Sir, the sample was from the brass T coming out of the basement wall straight from the well. Before the bladder tank and pot/pern. I did forget to sterilize the spigot though.
Would 10% crosslink resin be the stuff I want or 8% or something else?
And does .03 ml/g in iron require a pot/perm? Seems like a low number and maybe the iron out salt would take care of that. The water has a strong sulfur smell without the pot/perm though.

 

[Reach4]

Looks to me as if you don't need anything but a softener. And even that is not urgent.

Note that amounts with a "<" had values lower than the sensitivity of the test.

 

[adayrider]

Opps I edited while you posted

 

[Reach4]

and does .03 ml/g in iron require a pot/perm? Seems like a low number and maybe the iron out salt would take care of that. The water has a strong sulfur smell without the pot/perm though.

Your number is "Iron, total 0.03 mg/L" fortunately. The softener will have no problem with that. I would use Morton System Saver II Water Softening Pellets, myself. It has a bit of rust removing stuff. You don't have enough iron to call for the special rust remover version, which sells at a bit of a premium.

The H2S (sulfur smell) does not get tested in that test. So whatever fixes that, keep it. You might be able to deal with that in another way, but you are not starting from scratch. I would sanitize my system in the spring. http://www.moravecwaterwells.com/index.php/maintainance/disinfection-and-testing is my favorite procedure for that. Your sulfate number is low, so I was suspecting you might not have a sulfur smell. If your sulfur smell is more in the hot water, there are some addtional things I would do.

 

[ditttohead]

The 9000, don't bother. If it is 15 years old, the valve body castings have a tendency to get damaged internally. The 7000 would be a simpler and better choice. The Pot Perm system is not typically used but they are very effective. I would lean toward replacing the media with Katalox Light and forgo the regnerant until you determine if it is still needed. Katalox light typically does not require a regenerant at higher pH levels. You can always add the regenerant later. Pot Perm, Chlorine, etc work well with KL. The bacteria issue, it may be worth a retest. Bacteria in water is natural, normal, and usually not a problem, it is an indicator that should be monitored. Sanitizing your well and plumbing intermittently is also worth considering.

 

[adayrider]

Hold on here, I think I got my wires crossed. I have a greensand that has a 2 maybe 3 gallon tank that I put potassium in with a fleck 2500 on a 10-47 tank on timer. It takes all iron out of the water(no rust stains in toilets) and it takes the sulfur smell out of the water. I brought it over from old house to help keep iron out and smell out till I got a softner

I will throw the 9000 out.

So Fleck 7000 sxt will be a good choice for softner but what resin should I get in it? 8%, 10%, fine?
48000 or 1.5 or should I go with 2.0 which is what? 64000

Dittohead
Are you saying that I can replace the greensand with Katalox light and unplud the the valve and just let water filter through with no regeneration cycles? And this will soften my water? Will this also remove the solfur smell? Solfur smell is pretty bad when I use the hot water.

Edit I read that wrong. Your saying to use Katalox light in the 7000 sxt and the greensand matbe.

 

[Bannerman]

Are you saying that I can replace the greensand with Katalox light and unplud the the valve and just let water filter through with no regeneration cycles? And this will soften my water?

Katalox Light would replace the Greensand media. KL is for removal of sulfur and iron. Your iron is so low that it's not a concern on its own but if a filter is needed for sulfur, the iron will be removed also.

The KL filter would require backwashing on a regular basis but would not necessarily need a regenerant such as pot perm or chlorine.

If your sulfur issue is only present in the hot water, that is likely a reaction with the water heater anode rod. Changing the rod with one of another material may eliminate the sulfur odor and could eliminate the necessity for the KL filter.

Before replacing the anode, raise the water heater temperature to above 150 degrees for a few hours as bacteria can colonize within the heater when the temperature is maintained below 140 degrees. Run the hotter water to each of the fixtures to also disinfect the water lines and then see if the sulfur odor is eliminated. The temperature can be reduced to a lower setting again following disinfection but you will probably need to perform the disinfection procedure periodically.

For a softener, as your water is not chlorinated, standard 8% cl softener resin will work great whereas 10% has a higher tolerance to chlorine and has a higher cost. Fine mesh resin is slightly more efficient in iron reduction but is not often recommended due to having a tendency to restrict water flow.

With 3 people and 11 gpg hardness (10.2 is above 10), a 1 cuft softener will satisfy your needs but a 1.5 cuft will provide a higher SFR (12 vs 9 gpm) and will reduce the regeneration frequency.

 

[adayrider]

Excellent
Thanks alot everyone.
Bannerman, Perfect explanation, thank you. When we moved in 4 months ago it was real bad the first week so I turned the water heater all the way up (150 is highest setting). After another week it did get better but did not go away and noticed some rust color in the toilets tank. Thats when I installed the used greensand from old house and it removed the little rust and took the smell away completely. When took my water sample I filled a 50 gallon tote before sample and the basement smelled like sulfur big time. And that is straight from the well T before the heater so it is in the cold water.

First thing to do is get a 7000 sxt 8% 1.5 for my hard water

Then I will rework the greensand maybe to Katalox Light

With this Katalox Light, How do you backwash without regeneration? And what do you use to regen with? salt, potassium, something else? And what kind of valve and size tank is needed?
Thanks alot

 

[Bannerman]

As you were having success in removing the sulfur odor with the Greensand filter, I expected the issue was not only in the hot water but ... you specifically mentioned the sulfur odor being bad in the hot water.

Katalox Light is very effective without any regenerant so the media would be backwashed with only plain water which will reclassify the media and will flush away any sediment collected in the bed. You could install a plug in the port where the pot perm is normally drawn-in and also change the setting to reduce the draw time. As Dittohead mentioned, pot perm or chlorine could be later added if you find that a regenerant is needed.

I got the impression that you had intended to reutilize the existing Greensand system. A 10" X 54" is the usual size for 1.5 cuft of media so your 10" X 47" maybe more suitable for 1.25 cuft. Perhaps one of the other tanks you already have from the 9000 system, is a little larger.

FYI, the iron out salts are only utilized to assist in cleaning away iron buildup from the softener resin and softener internals. The resin itself is what removes the iron when an iron removal filter is not utilized. A softener is ineffective for a sulfur issue.

 

[Reach4]

Hold on here, I think I got my wires crossed. I have a greensand that has a 2 maybe 3 gallon tank that I put potassium in with a fleck 2500 on a 10-47 tank on timer. It takes all iron out of the water(no rust stains in toilets) and it takes the sulfur smell out of the water. I brought it over from old house to help keep iron out and smell out till I got a softner

To be clear, the sample tested was from after the greensand filter?

 

[adayrider]

Reach4
Once again NO I did not take sample after greensand. I took sample from the Brass Tank Tee (official Home Depot name). Pipe from well comes through wall into the Brass Tank Tee that houses a pressure guage, pump switch and 2 faucets and some kind of spring loaded faucet with no handle (looks like it some sort of pressure releif valve). 1 side of Tee goes to bladder tank the other side of Tee feeds greensand and then house. I took sample from the faucet in this Tee which is before the greensand.

Bannerman

As you were having success in removing the sulfur odor with the Greensand filter, I expected the issue was not only in the hot water but ... you specifically mentioned the sulfur odor being bad in the hot water.

Yes Sir it does smell more after heating it but smells pretty bad in the cold by itself and turning up the hot water heater to max does not eliminate it.

Katalox Light is very effective without any regenerant so the media would be backwashed with only plain water which will reclassify the media and will flush away any sediment collected in the bed. You could install a plug in the port where the pot perm is normally drawn-in and also change the setting to reduce the draw time. As Dittohead mentioned, pot perm or chlorine could be later added if you find that a regenerant is needed.

Ok then sound more efficient them buying potassium if this works BUT will it work for eliminating the sulfur odor? Even if I have to regen with potassium once every ??? whenever?

I got the impression that you had intended to reutilize the existing Greensand system. A 10" X 54" is the usual size for 1.5 cuft of media so your 10" X 47" maybe more suitable for 1.25 cuft. Perhaps one of the other tanks you already have from the 9000 system, is a little larger.

Yes Sir I would like to reutilize the greensand and by your answer here I can. But all 3 tanks (the 1 for greensand and the 2 for the 9000 are all 10-47) are same size. Will this be OK no matter which way I go (greensand or Katalox Light)?

FYI, the iron out salts are only utilized to assist in cleaning away iron buildup from the softener resin and softener internals. The resin itself is what removes the iron when an iron removal filter is not utilized. A softener is ineffective for a sulfur issue.

I did not know this and makes perfect sense now that you explain it.

 

[Reach4]

Reach4
Once again NO I did not take sample after greensand.

I thought "Hold on here, I think I got my wires crossed." was rescinding something you had previously posted, and I thought it might be that. I now think that was because you had called your greensand filter, that uses a pot perm solution for regeneration, a pot/perm.

"Iron, total 0.03 mg/L" is a very low number , particularly one where you said "I need to fix it right to help keep iron stains down".

 

[Bannerman]

BUT will it work for eliminating the sulfur odor?

KL is effective in reducing hydrogen sulphide on its own without a regenerant but as advised, use it without a regenerant but if it is found to not be effective enough, you can then add a regenerant.

KL will be more effective than GS so if the existing amount of GS is working for you, the KL should be even better.

http://watchwater.com/katalox_light/katalox_light.php

 

[adayrider]

I thought "Hold on here, I think I got my wires crossed." was rescinding something you had previously posted, and I thought it might be that. I now think that was because you had called your greensand filter, that uses a pot perm solution for regeneration, a pot/perm.

"Iron, total 0.03 mg/L" is a very low number , particularly one where you said "I need to fix it right to help keep iron stains down".

I'm sorry, Yes Sir that is the wires I crossed, I thought the greensand was a pot/perm and I guess it is not.
I was surprised at how low the iron was in the test. The sulfur smell is pretty bad though and the greensand takes it out for whatever reason though. So sense I already have it I might as well rebuild it and do away with the smell and get rid of the small amount of iron as well was my thinking. I can be persuaded in another direction though if you or someone that knows more than me. Which would not take much.
Thanks alot

 

[Bannerman]

Pot perm (Potassium permanganate) is the regenerant used to rejuvenate the Greensand media. That system is effective for iron and sulfur.

As Dittohead stated, pot perm systems are not typically used much any more. He then recommended KL without any regenerant but stated that chlorine or pot perm could be added only IF a regenerant is found to be necessary.

As bacteria was identified in your test results, it maybe beneficial obtaining a second test after first disinfecting the valve where the water sample was obtained.

 

[Reach4]

I see no reason to change what is working, unless the pot perm is expensive or inconvenient. The KL probably has about the same backwash GPM requirements as greensand.

You mentioned a smell from the hot water. This H2S production can come from sulfate reducing bacteria(SRB) reacting with the WH anode. Sulfate is part of that reactions. While your sulfate is fairly low, I guess there is enough. Since this H2S is produced in the WH, just filtering prior to the WH will not be effective enough, as far as I can tell. There are those who remove the anode for this reason, but I think this can reduce the WH life. The WH life is also affected by the characteristics of the water. The purpose of the anode is to protect the steel of the WH from corroding thru where there are cracks in the glass coating. I bought a powered anode, which protects as well as a magnesium anode, but does not react to help produce the H2S. Those are not cheap, because they are not high-volume products. I expect to move that powered anode to my next WH.

There are aluminum/zinc anodes that react less than magnesium, but they don't protect as well. And they still react.

Another thing that may cut down on this reaction is cranking up the WH temperature, making it hotter for the bulk of the SRB. A sanitizing that includes the WH as well as the well and other plumbing can help for a significant time with that, until the SRB get a chance to recolonize. Using the sanitizing method with the "flooding volume" can help with that.