How to add Utility Sink and Washer Drain to existing 4"

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice' started by obriendigital, Mar 25, 2011.

  1. obriendigital

    obriendigital New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Hello,

    I am trying to add a sink drain and also a washer box. The black lines in the photo show existing infrastructure. I would like to install a sink and washer box. I am assuming I will need to cut into the 3 to 4" section with the cleanout and install some sort of T with a 2" out to the drain for the sink and washer. Where do I put the P trap or traps and also where is it best to vent. I also have a 2" pipe on the other side of the wall that could be accessed overhead for a vent. Could someone please help draw this out for me? Thank you!!!

    Tim

    Attached Files:

  2. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    Every drain requires a trap and vent.

    What makes you think you can tie into the 2" on the other side of the wall, it's likely a drain for a fixture on the floor above...?
  3. jimbo

    jimbo Plumber

    Messages:
    8,997
    Location:
    San Diego
    Youi need individual traps for the washer and sink. The devil is in the details of what you want to do here, and your drawings dont include details. Important are the fittings, slopes, etc.

    You need to know what that 2" line is before assuming it can be your vent. If it is draining a fixture above, it cannot be your vent.
  4. obriendigital

    obriendigital New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Thanks for your responses, after further analysis here is where I am at.

    I took a few photos to illustrate the project. I checked the 2" pipe further today and it is draining from a sink upstairs, so that won't work i guess for a vent? correct? this is the photo with the beer by it

    I also have a photo of the new cleanout and T to put into the 4" to 3" stack. Is this ok? The 2" will run around the corner to the sink and washer.
    The other photo is ultimately where I want the sink and washer.

    Lastly, there are a couple photos of the stack towards the ceiling, it looks like the left part of the Y is the main vent, can I tie into that with a saddle to 2" then over my wall to work as a vent?

    Attached Files:

  5. dlarrivee

    dlarrivee New Member

    Messages:
    1,172
    Location:
    Canada
    You need to do a lot more reading before attempting this.
  6. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    27,251
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    You can't use a "saddle" for the vent, and you absolutely CANNOT tie the 2" vent where you indicate in the bottom picture. Your whole concept MUST be changed, but we cannot "draw" a new system without knowing a whole lot more than you have shown us. You have watched too many "Anyone can do plumbing if they know how to glue fittings together" shows.
  7. obriendigital

    obriendigital New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Thanks for the replies. The thought was to put the vent in the top picture, that's a 3" vent. The bottom photo shows how that pipe turns and runs out as a vent....my arrow depicts the top photo. They are out of order.
  8. obriendigital

    obriendigital New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    Nebraska
    Thanks for your help. i will keep reading, but I think I have everything to specs, just unclear on vent process. Here are some photos that may better illustrate it.

    Attached Files:

  9. Basement_Lurker

    Basement_Lurker One who lurks

    Messages:
    668
    Location:
    Victoria, BC
    Wow, look at all the electrical lines bundled together....very naughty!
  10. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,416
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    The sink needs a vent
    The washer needs a vent.
    Both vents can be tied together above the washer box, and then run upstairs and tied in at 42" above the next floor.
    That means cutting the wall upstairs and dropping a vent down for lower floor plumbing.

    [​IMG]
  11. SacCity

    SacCity In the Trades

    Messages:
    189
    Location:
    Sacramento, CA
    Did you use PEX or soft copper for the short runs up to the washer?
    Michael
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 6, 2011
  12. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,416
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    Those were PEX, and I insulated them mainly because there was light coming through a window and I had no idea how soon there were going to cover.
    Normally I would have run hard copper. I had an inspector in Seattle that made me take out soft copper in a wall like that. You never know what they're thinking. I would think that type L soft would always be better then M hard. And I'm a big fan of "fewer" fittings.

    hj will argue that it could have been done with a wet vent, but this configuration will pass in all fifty states.

    [​IMG]
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2011
  13. SacCity

    SacCity In the Trades

    Messages:
    189
    Location:
    Sacramento, CA
    I strongly agree with you on the fewer fittings idea....
    What I am always concerned about is changing materials,
    Copper -plastic - copper etc...

    Are there any issues with mating soft copper to rigid copper?
    My thought is that the difference is heat treatment, but just guessing.
    I'm here to get an education .

    As for the PEX good call on the insulation, as PEX is rated for 1 day sun exposure, and the UV rated stuff is for 30 days....
    Michael
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 6, 2011
  14. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,416
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I've never had a issue with soft to hard copper joints. Even the old 50/50.
    The No-Lead solder makes a joint so tuff that the pipe will break before the joint does.
  15. jimbo

    jimbo Plumber

    Messages:
    8,997
    Location:
    San Diego
    Can't tell for sure which way is 'up' in the photos. That pipe that you call a vent...is that horizontal , and below the floor where the toilet it?? That is not acceptable.
  16. Inspektor Ludwig

    Inspektor Ludwig Journeyman/Inspector

    Messages:
    167
    Location:
    In the good ol' UPC
    It just makes my head hurt..............
    Made you take out type L soft copper? Hope he gave you a good reason, I don't see what the big deal is. Just a note: you can no longer wet vent a laundry sink into a c/w stack. Laundry sinks now require a 2" drain, who knows why they changed it. As for the diy guy, if you're planning on using that 3" vent for the upstairs toilet to vent your basement fixtures, you'll need to tie the vents in 6" higher than the toilet rim. That means running your washer and sink vent up the wall and then up into the wall on the next floor up until you are at least 6" higher than the toilet, then you can tie them together. You can't tie vents from first floor fixtures into vents for second floor fixtures below the floor of the second story fixture. That's BPK (basic plumbing knowledge) better read up some more before you're SOL. Oh yeah, no trap sharing please, let's keep it clean.
  17. MACPLUMB 777

    MACPLUMB 777 TROJAN WORLDWIDE SALES RP

    Messages:
    679
    Location:
    Houston, Texas, United States
    You do not go around corner,
    go straight though the wall, in running sewer pipe you always use the least amount of fittings and or 90's ell's !
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