How Best to Vent a Basement Bathroom

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Tom Sawyer

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Diverge ain't the word. As for HJ installing ejector pumps without a 2" through the roof I think you will find that he does indeed vent them and that vent it's into the vent through the roof. The pump won't work without a vent.

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richk

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It makes more sense in my situation to tie in a 2" to my current 4" (which comes through the roof) in the crawlspace.

So, in the basement, this new 2" will be used for the sewage pump, the basement bathroom group, and the kitchen sink vents.

Does that sound correct?

I'm still a bit unsure why the kitchen sink cant tie into the upstairs vents even though I am about 2" inches above the rim instead of 6" and what the danger is. Is it just that, if the bath sink clogs, the water will come through the vent to the kitchen sink? I dont see a differnce between 2" and 6" in that situation. I mean, is there a difference between 6" and 2" in terms of what the code accomplishes?

In any case, if I can safely use all three of them on my new 2" then that is what I will do.

Does that make sense?
 

richk

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Diverge ain't the word.

Sure it is. For what I was explaining. Not sure what you mean.

As for HJ installing ejector pumps without a 2" through the roof I think you will find that he does indeed vent them and that vent it's into the vent through the roof. The pump won't work without a vent.

But code, from what I understand, requires that a pump get its own dedicated vent through the roof. If it is shared, it against code, yet still safe. Which was my point--that sometimes code and safety diverge. In other words you can not follow code and still be safe.
 

hj

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quote; I think HJ himself, where states he has often (maybe always) installed sewage ejector pumps without running a 2" dedicated through the roof. A violation of code,

I was NOT a violation of ANY code where I have worked, so that is not a good defencse.
 

richk

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This post seems to indicate that a 2" vent is what code wants.
https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/sewage-ejector-venting.49478

Your first comment on this post is:
"I have NEVER installed a "vent through the roof" for an ejector pump system. Connecting to the existing vent is perfectly adequate, although it might not be "propeer" in some areas. The only reason for a dedicated vent is to minimize sewer gas odors when the pit's cover loses its seal. For that reason, your "vent for the pit and AAVs for the fixtures" would be a senseless solution. "

So, this means, whether it is code or not, that I likely do not need to go through the roof?

And, would you ever tie the pump into a 1.5" line? The reason I am here is to try and find out my safe options.
 

Tom Sawyer

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Your safe option is to go ask your local plumbing inspector or someone at the state plumbers board.
 

richk

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I just ran a 2" from the basement into the crawl space and connected to my 4" up there just a foot from where it goes through the roof.

So, all three vents (main floor kitchen, basement bathroom group, sewage pump) will get tied in to that in the basement... yes?

If it needs to go through the roof I will do that in the Spring when it warms up.
 

Cacher_Chick

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The important part is HOW you do it. Each fixture vent must be vertical at least until is has reached a point above the flood rim of the highest connected fixture. Proper trap to vent distances must be maintained and any horizontal piping must be properly pitched to drain.

42" above the floor or 6" above the flood rim is the standard measurement which ensures that the vent does not take in waste when the drain backs up.

When your new drain and vent system is in place, it should be pressure tested to ensure that you will not have sewer gas leaking into your home.
 

richk

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Vent to trap distances should all be fine.

Since the kitchen sink will be the highest fixture, I will then need to run two more lines up from the basement. But not to the crawlspace on the second floor, only to the main floor--6" above the kitchen sink. Its getting a bit tight in that wall, but there is room for two more--I think.

The kitchen sink has not had a vent for 10 years. And it has never been a problem. It drains fine. I dont know for sure that the trap isnt being syphoned, but I have never had any smells.

Actually, when I say kitchen sink it is two sinks (main and island --but no loop venting) and dishwasher. The two sinks drain in 2" and meet after about 5 feet, then run another 5 feet or so to the stack.

The only reason I am touching this waste line at all is because I need to re-route the it to lay out the bathroom. I figured I'd add a vent as well.
 
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richk

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and could someone explain this, which I found in the code:


"Vents less than six (6) inches above the flood-level rim of the fixture shall be installed with approved drainage fittings, material, and grade to the drain"
 

hj

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ANY 4" line in the crawl space or basement would seldom be a VENT. The "vent" part of it is in the attic, and that is where you would tie YOUR vents into it.
 

Cacher_Chick

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Part of the confusion here is terminology. The space directly below your roof is an attic. The space below your first floor is a crawl space or basement.

If you are cutting open the wall in your kitchen to tie the basement vent in, you would be smart to remove all of the old galvanized piping while you are in there.

dwv_b1.jpg
 

richk

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ANY 4" line in the crawl space or basement would seldom be a VENT. The "vent" part of it is in the attic, and that is where you would tie YOUR vents into it.

I see the explanation above about the terms. It is not a crawlspace. The correct word might be "knee-wall".

It is a small area on the second floor of an undormered cape where the ceiling joists meet the plate and instead of having the joist all the way to the floor in the room, 40" inch high wall is made.
 
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richk

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If you are cutting open the wall in your kitchen to tie the basement vent in, you would be smart to remove all of the old galvanized piping while you are in there.

Remove it all? Why would I do that? It appears to be in fine condition. Seems like a lot of uneccessary work.

Besides, the truth is it is easily accesible. It is the area behind the fridge and easy to get to.
 

Tom Sawyer

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and could someone explain this, which I found in the code:


"Vents less than six (6) inches above the flood-level rim of the fixture shall be installed with approved drainage fittings, material, and grade to the drain"


You are confusing this sentence. All readily available DWV fittings are approved for venting. That's why they are labeled DWV and approved or not you can't have any vents running horizontally unless they are 6" above the flood level rim of the highest fixture served.
 

hj

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quote; It is a small area on the second floor of an undormered cape where the ceiling joists meet the plate and instead of having the joist all the way to the floor in the room, 40" inch high wall is made.

You may STILL be confusing terms. "Joists" are UNDER the floor, so they cannot go "all the way to the floor", and "knee wall" is a short wall that does NOT go up to the ceiling.
 

richk

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You are confusing this sentence. All readily available DWV fittings are approved for venting. That's why they are labeled DWV and approved or not you can't have any vents running horizontally unless they are 6" above the flood level rim of the highest fixture served.

But the sentence clearly states (I think) that "vents less than 6" above the flood-level rim of the fixture shall be installed"... a certain way.

The full text of the code is:

Unless prohibited by structural conditions, each vent shall rise vertically
to a point not less than 6 inches above the flood rim of the fixture served
before setting off horizontally... Vents less than six inches below the flood
rim of the fixture shall be installed with approved drainage fittings, material
and grade to the drain.


If that doesnt mean that there is an alternative to the 6", someone please explain. Because it reads as clearly as possible to me.
 

Cacher_Chick

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It means that if it is between the flood rim and the mark 6" above the flood rim, your plumbing inspector MIGHT declare it acceptable IF he interprets the code the same way you do.
 
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