Help with sulfur problem, please!

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LFCraig

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Hi,

Looking for advice for treating sulfur and sulfur bacteria in water. I have had 4 companies come out to test the water and test results have been similar:

PH 8
TDS 1090
Iron 0.2 ppm
Sulfur 2.5 ppm
Hardness 6 grains

We have a softener, which is working fine.

The house came with a zeoprep (zeolite??) Iron/sulfur filter with air injection (its one tank) that doesn't work well for us at all. The sulfure smell is often present at the taps and tests show it is coming though the filter at 0.5ppm. We have a big blue filter downstream and it captures lots of oxidized sulfur. The filter is a Charger Iron Breaker III. It has a fleck 5600SXT valve which I've been told is responsible for the large amounts of air in our pipes, because it is lacking a check valve. It currently backwashes every night.

Our well is 10 years old, and 85 feet deep. 1\2 HP pump.

The solutions we have been offered are:
1 - Chlorine injection system with retention tank (40 gallon) plus rebedding our current filter with MangOx. Optional addition of a backwashing carbon filter on top of this.

2 - peroxide injection system with 40 gallon retention tank plus rebedding of our current filter with catalytic carbon.

3 - rainsoft greensand plus filter.

4 - vortech tank with clack valve using a mixture of KDF-85 and katalox light. The company offering this also said we should be shocking our well every 3 months.

So, now I'm very confused!

Looking for something that is going to work and not require a whole lot of maintenance. We plan to be in the house for a long time, so something that will last is also good.

Thoughts????
 

_John_

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I'd definitely do an oxidant injection, and the peroxide/catalytic carbon leaves you with the least to deal with in the end product water. Peroxide is more expensive than chlorine though.

Oxidant injection ahead of mangox and katalox light works good too. I'd worry about getting enough water to backwajs the mangox filter though (you may be fine, but it would be a concern of mine).
 

Reach4

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I am not a pro.

Regarding your filter, http://www.chargerwater.com/iron-h2s-filters states "For regeneration, the unit first “backwashes” itself, removing any iron particles it has trapped. The system then replenishes the “air bubble” by drawing in atmosphere, temporarily emptying the tank of all water and transferring oxygen molecules into and on the surface of the media bed where all oxidation occurs."

http://www.waterchoices.com/index.php?crn=224&rn=436&action=show_detail states that the ZeoPrep media is manganese dioxide based, and is effective against iron and manganese. It states that the life of the media may be greater than 10 years.

So my concern is whether that media is recommended as effective against sulfur. I don't know. My filter uses Centaur Carbon with a small amount of chlorine bleach used during the regen every 3 days. I add bleach plus water to the 15-gallon solution tank every 36 days or 5 weeks. It is effective against my levels of iron and sulfur, but I have never had a sulfur test with a numeric result.

If ZeoPrep media is effective vs sulfur, it is possible that sulfur contained in bacteria might hide from the media. So I would consider sanitizing the well. You may or may not be able to get rid of the sulfur reducing bacteria for a year or more. The method I like is http://www.moravecwaterwells.com/disin_test.htm It is more time-consuming than most procedures. Due to taking longer, it is maybe more suitable for DIY. I did it after recent well work, and I was able to extend the contact and recirculation times.

Also, if your sulfur smell is mainly from the hot water, there are things you could do for the hot water.

I expect somebody will endorse #1. That is a classic solution. It would be nice if there were a simpler solution.
 

Mikey

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I endorse #1, which has been working for me for over 13 years to treat pretty nasty water (iron + sulfur, in small amounts, but the water stinks) from a 190' well. I use a Pulsafeeder pump to inject a dilute Clorox solution into the line in front of a 120 gallon holding tank.The pump comes on when the well pump comes on, which is simple but much less than optimal, since the water at the tank isn't always flowing when the pump is running. The tank is pretty big, but an alternative, which I call a "swirly tank" (http://www.apwinc.com/retention_tank.html) is much smaller and looks to me to be a better solution. I'm planning to replace the big tank with one of these. There are also better pumps, which use the water flow to meter the injection (e.g., http://www.dultmeier.com/products/search/10686, http://hydrosystemsco.com/product/chemilizer/), which look to be a great match for the swirly tank.

A side effect of using chlorine is that my wife feels much better about the water, since she knows about bleach. Makes her feel much more comfortable when she sees horses peeing in the field about 100' from the well.
 

Reach4

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The tank is pretty big, but an alternative, which I call a "swirly tank" (http://www.apwinc.com/retention_tank.html) is much smaller and looks to me to be a better solution. I'm planning to replace the big tank with one of these.
Are you making the change just to save floor space, or was there a problem with your existing retention tank? There is not much info on that link other than to call for info.

I wonder if a softener tank could be adapted to that contact tank use by bringing the bottom water up the dip tube and on to the activated charcoal tank. I figure by routing the water that way any solids that have already settled would get drawn off of the bottom.

I know somebody with a chlorine injection/mixing system but no contact/retention tank before the activated charcoal. It is not quite effective.
 

LFCraig

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Also, if your sulfur smell is mainly from the hot water, there are things you could do for the hot water.

There is no smell at all from the hot water taps.

I should also mention that we add bleach to the backwash once every 2-3 weeks or earlier if the smell gets really bad. The time between bleaching seems to be getting shorter and shorter...

We have an RO, and the sediment filter gets covered in grey/green slime. We have changed it 4 times in 8 months!
 

Mikey

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Are you making the change just to save floor space, or was there a problem with your existing retention tank? There is not much info on that link other than to call for info.

Mainly to save floor space, and to make me sleep a little better as the old galvanized tank starts to show rust. Also, a lot of ferric iron is not precipitated out, and winds up getting caught in a spun filter which I'd like to eliminate. Finally, the bottom of the tank is convex (upward), with a drain hole about 8" up, so that just draining the tank isn't enough to clean it out. I have to remove it, turn it upside down, and use the pressure washer to dislodge the gunk. I'm getting too old for that.

You can see the patent for the "swirly tank" at http://www.google.com/patents/US7600911. Briefly, it actively swirls the water/chlorine mixture around to improve the mix, and the path through the tank is supposedly comlex enough that there's a high "baffling efficiency/factor", as used in the papers referenced below and thus a shorter transit time is needed. There are a lot of documents ("chlorine contact time") available to guide your design; simple at www.doh.wa.gov/portals/1/Documents/pubs/331-343.pdf, more complicated at: http://health.hawaii.gov/sdwb/files/2013/06/CT_Calc_Examples.pdf. It also has a nice low-point drain that allows a clean flush of the precipitates at the turn of a knob. Or, if you're really lazy, you can buy an electric valve and put it on a timer.

I wonder if a softener tank could be adapted to that contact tank use by bringing the bottom water up the dip tube and on to the activated charcoal tank. I figure by routing the water that way any solids that have already settled would get drawn off of the bottom.

That might work, but then you'd gunk up the charcoal filter. Maybe that's OK. Almost certain, though, that in times of high flow, there wouldn't be enough contact time.

I know somebody with a chlorine injection/mixing system but no contact/retention tank before the activated charcoal. It is not quite effective.
I'd love to know just what he's using for injection and mixing.
 

ditttohead

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Option #1 with Ferrilite (similar to Katalox Light), I am not a fan of mang-ox, too much water required to backwash it.
 

LFCraig

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Ok, thanks for all the advice :)

A few more questions, I guess.

Benefits of chlorine vs peroxide??

Is there a preferred method for chlorine administration? Feed pump? Pellets?

Do I need the additional back washing carbon filter after the iron filter in the chlorine setup? And why wouldn't I need an iron filter with the peroxide setup?.....

Thanks guys!
 

_John_

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A lot of customers prefer chlorine to be back out of the water after treatment, and peroxide is a littler cleaner oxidation. It's also a little stronger if you had higher levels of hydrogen sulfide and it reacts quicker.

Chlorine does give the benefit of a residual, that will sanitize everything down the line.

To some degree any particle filtration works if the oxidant is dosed enough/has enough contact time to full oxidize sulfur/iron/manganese. In a peroxide setup, the catalytic carbon ensures the peroxide is broken down to water and oxygen.

Getting rid of chlorine isn't "necessary" as far as I'm concerned as there is some benefit to having a residual. A simple point of use carbon filter (like in your fridge) is fine at the end of the process for a lot of people.

Some just prefer that chlorine out after oxidation is complete.
 

ditttohead

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Peroxide is more expensive and not readily available at your local store. Chlorine is cheap and easy to get, both work for what you are doing. Pellet feeders are cheap and simple, I prefer Water motor driven pumps. These dose accurately regardless of water flow. Pellet feeders are not accurate and they tend to be a little messier to maintain but they are cheaper initially.
Dema%20Mixrite%20Chemical%20Dosing%20Pump.jpg
 

Reach4

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I'd love to know just what he's using for injection and mixing.

Not cheap. About the diameter of maybe a 1-1/4 PVC pipe. It has internal structure. Chlorine solution is injected at tee a few feet to the right whenever the submersible pump runs. There is a pump atop the solution tank that pumps the solution.
 

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Mikey

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Not cheap. About the diameter of maybe a 1-1/4 PVC pipe. It has internal structure. Chlorine solution is injected at tee a few feet to the right whenever the submersible pump runs. There is a pump atop the solution tank that pumps the solution.
Looks like a very mini version of the "swirly tank"; I think I had heard of them before. Easy to see why it's not very effective.
 
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