help with options for comfort height bowl toilet, shelf on wall limits tank height

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by bridgeman3669, Sep 5, 2012.

  1. bridgeman3669

    bridgeman3669 New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Lethbridge Alberta Canada
    hi,
    i am wanting to replace toilet. and the ones that i have been looking at so far will not work as there is a narrow shelf that is part of the sink counter that goes over the tank floor to bottom of shelf is 30 1/2inches, then you would have to allow for lip to remove tank lid. also it eliminates option of top button flush, also is installed so close to cabinet the one in there has flush handle on left when facing it, and is not easy to access, so was wanting one with handle on other side
    the one i was looking at and was in my price range, as i am slightly disabled due to back/legs, were the comfort height bowl, 16 inches and taller, but total height of tank allowing for lid removal/overlap has to be similiar to existing toilet tank height with lid on 29 1/2 inches, which doesnt leave much room for adjusting or servicing parts inside, so something 29 inch height but somewhere between 28-29 inches would be better. i am not able to get out and shop around. i almost bought a mansfield Alto 137-160 (smart height, elongated w/smartclose seat) but it is to tall of tank at 31 inches. and the toilets i was looking at getting i was going to have a young plumber friend of mine install and p/u from supplier. he just doesnt have the time to go thru all there specs and options. he asked me to find a couple options that were in my price range and mentioned drake was about same price for him to buy as the mansfield, he also mentioned he could get gerber, carouso and toto, but was unsure of models in that price range with that bowl and tank height and good reviews. so i can do the research part so he can give me a deal, just need some suggestions. i can use the computer i just cannot get out to stores or wholesale suppliers and physically shop around to see what they have, also as i mentioned wanted to stay in the price range wholesale, as i am on limited budget. i believe when he did call re the drake it was 45 day wait to order a that one with those features.
    so smart/comfort height 16" aprox
    elongated
    tank height less than 29 inch
    can anyone help me out maybe there is a toilet other than the drake that supplier can get in sooner or has, i would appreciate it
  2. kreemoweet

    kreemoweet New Member

    Messages:
    371
    Location:
    Seattle. WA
    Can the offending shelf not be removed? It seems to be causing difficulties, and there are any number of options for hanging a shelf higher up if one
    is required in that area.
  3. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,349
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    The Toto Supreme ADA, MS866114L, will work quite well for you. It measures 25-1/2" from the floor to the top of the tank. Price might be a problem for you since this, as with any low profile toilet, is a one piece and they are not in the low budget section. Terry Love does not recommend on-line ordering due to the high rate of breakage during shipping, but that may be you best option. There are many places that offer Toto toilets on-line so you can look for the best deal. If you do purchase a toilet on-line, examine it very carefully for breakage before you accept delivery. You can see many of the Toto toilets on Terry's link at the top of this page. Click Toilet Review, then Shopping, and then Toto. Now you can scroll through the models and if there is one that interests you, click on Specifications. That will give you the measurements. Terry's prices may not be totally current and because he is a volume dealer, his prices may be lower than many other places. Of course, a trip to Seattle would work too! Maybe a bit far just to buy a toilet.
  4. bridgeman3669

    bridgeman3669 New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Lethbridge Alberta Canada
    no the shelf cannot be replaced w/o a lot of extra cost to repair drywall, paint and alter the one piece sink counter which is what the shelf is, they just made a cut out for toilet area but left a 7-8" shelf so the laminate and oak edging is all one piece and new tile is siliconed to it, etc, alot of extra work than finding a toilet that would work with proper dimensions
  5. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Messages:
    1,852
    Location:
    New York, NY
    Well the ADA-height Drake, with the right hand trip lever, CST744SLR, is going to be 30.5" high at the top of the tank with the lid on. The regular-height CST744SR is going to be 28.5" to the top of the tank with the lid on. (The "R" in the model is for the right-hand trip lever. The Drake II is automatically universal-height, CST454CEFRG, and it's 30.0" to the top of the lid. That's a little better, but that 1/2" isn't going to make it easy to get into it to replace or repair anything.

    The comfort-height Supreme II has a low integrated tank, but it is a good deal more money: MS634114cefg, but at least it comes already with a nice seat. 25 9/16" high.

    The comfort-heigh Ultramax II has a regular-height inegrated tank that is about as high as the regular Drake, but has a seat at the ADA-compliant height; it is priced just a little less than the supreme, unfortunately. 28 3/4" high with lid on. MS604114CEFRG

    Hope this helps. One option which might allow you to have the regular Drake's tank height and affordable price, but still get your higher sitting position would be to use one of those special thicker seats. Not perfect, but gets you the price and height of the regular Drake tank, with the sitting position you desire. Look up "elevated toilet seat" or "raised toilet seat" online, say on E Bay; they're in the $10-$30 range.

    Hope this helps! Good luck!

    EDIT: Gary makes a good suggestion re the supreme, but the Supreme II with the model number I mentioned (newer version) is actually a little less expensive than the ADA-height old supreme, and includes some additiional good features as standard.

    However, neither the Supreme nor the Supreme II come with a right-handle option. So, my choice would be:

    Elongated Drake at regular height with right handle tank plus you find the higher seat OR
    Ultramax II at universal height (includes seat) with right-handle (about twice as much as Drake).
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2012
  6. bridgeman3669

    bridgeman3669 New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Lethbridge Alberta Canada
    well i guess i will wait 45 plus days and order the drake 2 piece which is within a one dollar difference of the mansfield. actually i cannot do that my friend leaves in 3 weeks to town 2 hrs away..... i was just curious about the others toto, carouso, or a gerber as i went to cpl sites and as my adobe pdf is not working if they have a spec file i cannot view, or they do not show the bowl and tank heights. i know the carouso was 28 3/8 tank height but think he said that was a lower bowl.........price is an issue the drake and mansfield were almost same price, carouso 50 bucks cheaper but if it is low bowl then not going to work for me. the budget i am in is max the drake or mansfield alto 137-160 for elongated, comfort height so easier to stand back up. there has to be one with those dimensions, features, similiar quality, price/budget? i just can't sit at this stupid desktop computer more than 10 mins every cpl hrs due to back.
  7. bridgeman3669

    bridgeman3669 New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Lethbridge Alberta Canada
    thank you guys, i have a cpl days, so hopefully will cross fingers for response that will work the best, and as my friend is giving me break on instalation would like to find before week is up. i appreciate the advice and opinions so far , and one question , ADA height? is that american disability assoc? ok will keep watching for replies. thank you guys
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2012
  8. wjcandee

    wjcandee Wise One

    Messages:
    1,852
    Location:
    New York, NY
    ADA Height means compliant with the Americans With Disabilities Act. Sorry. Duh. You're in Canada. The Universal Height Toto has a bowl which is a nudge lower than the ADA Height Toto, but with the seat it becomes compliant.
  9. bridgeman3669

    bridgeman3669 New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Lethbridge Alberta Canada
    i just realized this may allow other options re handle side limiting a toilet model choice, because the existing toilet tank is possibly wider than new toilets i could go with one with left side handle, the toilet i have to take out, we were going to repair, but would have to take tank off to replace fill tube etc because of height of tank. which i still plan on doing once it is out, then move it downstairs when repaired to replace a 55 yr old toilet that is very low 14" bowl, and would fit fine down there plenty of clearance, and handle is not affected by being to close to sink cabinet like upstairs is 1/4 inch or less from side of sink cabinet and hidden under shelf across top of tank. also then i have an extra toilet of good height down for $30 in parts and less labour as cannot afford 2 toilets. so the toilet upstairs is only about 6 yrs old, but cost so much to service for need to remove tank, and you can't access that side to clean it, old home, poor planning cause they could have moved base over a cpl inches to center under shelf, but they did'nt. the tank as i mentioned may be wider than new ones most likely?, the tank is 18 1/2" at bottom and tapers to 21 1/2 at the top including edge to lid and handle, but the bowl is elongated and is 17" high, so i would fix it once taken out and able to access tank and replace failing fill tube etc. so for the new toilet could be comfort height somewhere with bowl say 15 3/4" plus seat and up, and elongated, just need to be between 28-29 tank height, and if tank width is less than 21 1/2 wide at top which is width with lid on tank that is same width where handle is on left with less than 1/4" clearance, say even an in or more narrow at top, plus sitting between 28-29" max height i could use a left hand flush. as we are having to move/sell next yr, this seems the most economical way, finishes updating main bathrm up with functioning toilet, and the upstairs one taken off, repaired, cleaned up, and replace the 55 yr old one down stairs that is corroded and sits so low. maybe this helps with options for a toilet that is only left flush for new one upstairs. and thanks for clearing up ADA, and info so far. oh and then re "EDIT: Gary makes a good suggestion re the supreme, but the Supreme II with the model number I mentioned (newer version) is actually a little less expensive than the ADA-height old supreme, and includes some additiional good features as standard.

    However, neither the Supreme nor the Supreme II come with a right-handle option."
    is this an option then?
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2012
  10. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,003
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    The top of the ADA Drake is at least 30-1/2" tall, making it too tall for your shelf. It can be also ordered with a RH tank lever.
    The Ultramax II is 28-3/4" tall. That's a maybe. It also has a right hand tank lever option. MS604114CEFRG
    The Supreme II, at 25-3/4", Even better.
    Kohler Santa Rose comes in at 27"
    All of these have tall bowls.
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2012
  11. bridgeman3669

    bridgeman3669 New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Lethbridge Alberta Canada
    thank you Terry, i did just add a comment re: tank width may allow me to use toilet with only left flush, and i will write these models down and price them out, hope they are going to work, the high for tanks sounds good, and tall bowls, just have to see if budget is same. i appreciate it. kevin
  12. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,631
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    quote; Can the offending shelf not be removed?

    It is NOT a "shelf", it is a "banjo top" and a narrow extension of the countertop over the toilet tank. I have "modified" the tank lid so it slides in, rather than having to be lifted off, when the banjo top creates a problem.
  13. bridgeman3669

    bridgeman3669 New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Lethbridge Alberta Canada
    hi hj, how did you modify lid? special saw and blade or? cause there was one was looking at can get right away that is 29 3/8 i think that i could get right away. thx, kev
  14. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,631
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    UI use an angle grinder with a diamond blade to remove any lugs on the bottom of the lid.
  15. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,349
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    To my limited knowledge, the right hand flush is not an option. You certain can contact Toto for a better answer. However, since the tank is only 16-1/2" wide, and with the height of 25-1/2" there will be plenty of room to access the handle. Just it illustrate this point, here is how my Toto Dartmouth is installed. When I remodeled the bathroom years ago, I wanted vanity as large as possible. The toilet flange was roughed in at the proper spacing from the side wall, but I cheated a bunch on the other side. There's only a couple of inches space between the toilet and the vanity! The original toilet had a front facing handle, so this was not a problem. The Dartmouth is considerable higher than the Supreme II, so there is very little space for the handle, but it has not proven to be a problem at all. You need to remember that a low flush toilet needs only a quick push to activate the flush. You do not hold the handle down on any low flush toilet because that would completely drain the tank; about 3 gallons total, and this would defeat the low flush function. The extra water is simply to provide a bit more pressure to the flush.
  16. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,631
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    quote; The toilet flange was roughed in at the proper spacing from the side wall, but I cheated a bunch on the other side. There's only a couple of inches space between the toilet and the vanity

    Then some inspector must have gotten "paid off" because the "side wall" dimension applies to BOTH sides.
  17. bridgeman3669

    bridgeman3669 New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Location:
    Lethbridge Alberta Canada
    well thank you all for input, it looks like i am going with toto drake, the height is the same on tank as mine at 29 1/2", but tank is 20" to outside of handle so allows me an extra 1 1/2" space, and has comfort height bowl. my plumber measured the one in his dads home, and will work. i dont have to wait 4-5 weeks, and i can fix existing toilet and put down and get rid of the 50+ yr old toilet that is way too low, etc....
    have a great weekend guys
    i appreciate it
    kevin
  18. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,349
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    Well HJ, I didn't realize I needed a permit and inspection to replace a 30" vanity with a 36" one. I didn't move the toilet at all. Now I do admit that the vanity sets closer than code to the toilet, but at least where I am, they don't require an inspection of every new vanity that is installed, so I didn't have to bribe an inspector.
  19. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

    Messages:
    22,003
    Location:
    New England
    The only toilets from (most) anyone that give you an option of which side the flush handle are on are those specified as ADA toilets...that code requires the handle to be on the side nearest the door so it can be accessed from the wheelchair - the person may not be able to reach over the toilet to get to it if it were next to the wall. To give the designers some layout choices, most places make that an option.
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