Granite support for island

Discussion in 'Remodel Forum & Blog' started by HoneySuckle, Mar 10, 2007.

  1. HoneySuckle

    HoneySuckle New Member

    Messages:
    126
    I had three wooden corbels made up for my island overhang but think they look very old fashioned and my kitchen has a modern look. Our granite install is not due for another two weeks so what can I use in place of these wooden corbels? I really don't like them:eek: My island will have approximately 12" overhang and the installer says he will not install anything with an overhang that is more than 6".
  2. Mikey

    Mikey Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek

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    2,713
    Location:
    Central Florida
    I googled {modern corbels} and got about 95,000 hits, the first few of which were manufacturers of the things in a gazillion styles. If none of these work for you, you could just let simple cantilever beams into the top of the island. They could be made of wood, or a more "modern" looking material like stainless steel. A standard shape (box beam, I-beam, etc.) wouldn't be terribly expensive, but a good shop could come up with anything you'd like.
  3. kids test limits and break things

    have you had a talk with the kids and with the installer, about how much weight the stone will take before cracking?

    IKEA sells triangular braces (i guess they're corbels), that look clean and modern.

    david
  4. HoneySuckle

    HoneySuckle New Member

    Messages:
    126


    We don't have an IKEA and it would take too long to reach me. Someone had suggested them as well.

    Mikey I also googled and found a few but nothing I liked. Do you think fabricators sell these things? Are braces attached the same way as wooden/metal corbels?
  5. Bob NH

    Bob NH In the Trades

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    3,317
    Location:
    New Hampshire
    You will have adequate support for the granite if you put a number of 2x8's extending outward from the base, with the length of the 2x8's running transverse to the top of the countertop. Ideally, they can extend across the full countertop and be supported on both sides. If that is not possible, they can extend equal distance on either side of the edge supporting the 12" overhang. The granite can be supported on the outside ends and the inside ends of the 2x8's.

    The ends of the 2x8's can be covered with some kind of trim, and are probably invisible because they are so far under the edge.

    The 2x8s can be spaced about 16 to 24 inches. The granite can be supported using a flexible adhesive.

    Another solution if height is available is to install a glued-together double thickness of 3/4 plywood or OSB extending out far enough to support the granite.
  6. toolaholic

    toolaholic General Contractor Carpenter

    Messages:
    874
    Location:
    Marin Co. Ca.
    just did this for granite with a much larger overhang!

    Used 3/8" x4" steel flat stock. steel holes counter for screws. Son did this prep for granite installers. He has all the specs. If you need them ,let Me know
  7. toolaholic

    toolaholic General Contractor Carpenter

    Messages:
    874
    Location:
    Marin Co. Ca.
    P S

    can't believe You 're guy doesn't know this! How much experiance does He have?
  8. HoneySuckle

    HoneySuckle New Member

    Messages:
    126
    Yes, I would love the specs please. Basically the fabricator said I had to get the support for my granite top.

    Bob, who would do those 2 x 8s? :confused:
  9. toolaholic

    toolaholic General Contractor Carpenter

    Messages:
    874
    Location:
    Marin Co. Ca.
    will post specs. tonight, Honey. This is the way to go. been at this 45 yrs so far!
  10. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,309
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    corbels

    The granite guy is not going to suggest anything, because if the granite cracks he would be responsible if you used his suggestion.
  11. PEW

    PEW DIY Senior Member

    Messages:
    487
    I would, and have used, either 3/8 flat, or 1 to 1.5 inch angle iron. The application of either is going to depend on the cabinets you have, how they can be supported, and where the brackets have to be attached.

    My last installation used 1X1 angle iron with plates welded to it allow them to be bolted to the side panels of the cabinets. The faces of the cabinets had to be cut out to allow for the iron. They were supporting a 19 inch overhang.

    I agree, fabricators do not want to take the responsibility of making recommendations.

    Keep in mind that one SF of 3cm granite is about 20 pounds, plus kids, people leaning on it, etc.
  12. Bob NH

    Bob NH In the Trades

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    3,317
    Location:
    New Hampshire
    Any carpenter, or the cabinet installer, can install 2x8's or a deck or 3/8" thick steel plates on top of the frame of the cabinet. I would put something in to span the front-to-back of the cabinet and extend enough to provide support within 6" of the edge of the granite.

    I'm surprised that the granite installer hasn't provided you with a plan for what is considered acceptable.
  13. toolaholic

    toolaholic General Contractor Carpenter

    Messages:
    874
    Location:
    Marin Co. Ca.
    OK WENT BACK to Tiberon job today

    By the way this is around a 4 1/2 Mill. home set on 2 1/2 acres in Tiberon ca. with a view on the G G bridge. My son used 1/2" x2" steel flat stock. the overhang is 13" steel sets in 6" from each end of 8' counter and are placed 24" on center. plywood substrate is 3/4" Brian routed out 1/2" grooves into the ply top. counter is rock solid. Neat detail no angle iron leg exposed. good luck
  14. HoneySuckle

    HoneySuckle New Member

    Messages:
    126
    They only advised that we have some type of support saying that what we choose is personal. Probably don't want to have any problems down the line. Our granite is 2 cm. I even asked about plywood and they don't use this. The granite goes directly over island and cabinets. Is this normal procedure?:confused:
  15. just an idea.

    here may be where you need a handyman who really feels comfortable with the concept of "strength" in supports. Someone who is comfortable with metal and wood.

    Any support will work.

    Personally I would feel comfortable with buying cold-rolled soft steel tubes (either 1/2"x1" or 1/2"x1.5") with 0.065mm thickness walls (that's 1/16th" thick) and building them (welding them) into a support that sticks out 11". Looking at it from underneath, it would look like the letter "E" with the outside corners cut at 45 degree angles. The three prongs continue and go inside (if possible) the kitchen island, or if not possible, then the two outside ones continue underneath the granite, but outside the kitchen island cabinet, and keep going to the end, just to keep visual continuity. If you have no idea what all this means, find someone who has a few welding machines in his basement, and ssk him what argon is. Ideally, this kind of handyman -- who owns welding machines -- is someone who likes a cute and beautiful little project. Cost is $100 approx.

    David
  16. toolaholic

    toolaholic General Contractor Carpenter

    Messages:
    874
    Location:
    Marin Co. Ca.
    I am a cert welder ,with portable lincoln ,and 2 millers

    I have been in the trades for 45 years. Ex pile buck. WE can build our own cabinets. I gave You GOOD INFO. This guy isn't putting down a 3/4" plywood base? Where did You find this Guy? Your in TROUBLE! good luck
  17. FWIW, there are people installing granite now with no ply under.

    Recently I saw a 2cm thick countertop that stuck out 24" -- bare and unsupported -- and it was finally supported on one leg centered near the end. Nothing else. Obviously nobody is ever going to get up on it, because it looks too flimsy.

    Honey, getting back to your case: I saw you asked near the begining "Do you think fabricators sell these things? Are braces attached the same way as wooden/metal corbels?"

    Just to be sure we are helping you, I'll generalize your requirement. Here goes: any triangle is a brace (a corbel is a brace), and any two screws, one at each end, will hold the (triangular) brace in place, strong enough to do the job necessary. It's the triangle that does the job. It just happens that steel and some other metals are so strong that the triangle can become almost invisible to "you", since its shape looks more like a stick sticking out than a formal triangle. The three points of the triangle are still there, but flattened into a 1" or 2" bar or tube or "flat stock".

    Any support will work. Any triangle, whether it looks like an empty triangle or not, whether a bar, tube, wood beam or whatever.

    Your distance to support is short.

    Your kids may promise never to sit on it or stress it with sudden shocks, blows and bumps, in which case you could leave it unsupported. Ha.

    david
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2007
  18. toolaholic

    toolaholic General Contractor Carpenter

    Messages:
    874
    Location:
    Marin Co. Ca.
    2mm your right

    We use 5/8" +ply sorry 6" no sweat.
  19. HoneySuckle

    HoneySuckle New Member

    Messages:
    126
    With a deadline to work towards, we had to install some type of brackets and my husband was able to find some shelf brackets at Lowes. We bought three of them and the installer pressed as hard as he could (he was a biggie) and it didn't budge so we're hoping that this is all the support we will need. Luckily we only have 2cm granite if that makes a difference. Thanks for helping out. Will at least be able to use your ides for my brother's remodel:)
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