Framing for an under mount tub installation

Discussion in 'Shower & Bathtub Forum & Blog' started by johnfrwhipple, Mar 28, 2013.

  1. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    Design Work World Wide: Bathrooms Vancouver Area
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    North Vancouver, BC
    One question that gets asked a lot online is how to "Under Mount" a tub. It's a really good question because there is no real guidelines to follow, at least not from a tile installation point of view. I have been helping out this guy in Ontario (will call him Steve B) with some design ideas for his new bathroom renovation.

    The best advice I can give you is make it TANK LIKE


    To test my framing on this job I invited the client up on the prep work (prior to stone going in) and we jumped together. The prep work did not butch.

    No movement - no vibration.

    There is roughly a 4.5" set back shown here and a double strip of LED's under the face.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 26, 2016
  2. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    Design Work World Wide: Bathrooms Vancouver Area
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    North Vancouver, BC
    The hardest part I think for the framing and installation is allowing room for the tub filler and hand held spray hose. Making sure you have room for the hose to retract and not interfere with the plumbing lines is key.

    On my current project we have only a wall hung tub filler and wall mounted flow controls. Easy this way.

    This tub has it's own lighting. Not one of my builds but one I like to show new clients.

    [​IMG]

    The tub has I think 4 tub lights. The effect is cool almost uplighting the slate walls...
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2014
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  4. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    North Vancouver, BC
    A soaker tub has so much room for water - with this comes so much weight.

    The tub should not compress when filled so bracing the tub from below and the top ois key I think.


    [​IMG]

    Of course the lights are a nice touch!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 26, 2016
  5. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    Hey Vegas - are the switches on these jazzui tubs low voltage? I want to rip out the tub mounted switch and place it on the wall.

    Just wondering if the installation angle might affect some kind of switching mechanism.
     
  6. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

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    Most of them are "air switches" so there is no "power" by the tub user.
     
  7. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

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    John; I looks like you are taking over some of these categories.
     
  8. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    Air Switch would be awesome HJ. I'm going to install some Schluter Profile to the edge of the tub deck so when the stone goes over top there is not such a shadow reveal like the last job. I also think the Chrome accent will look sharp.

    What do you mean by "you are taking over some of these categories." ? This will be only my third showcase of the under-mount tub. I have two online clients building their own right now. That makes five total.

    It's a sharp look and makes for a more waterproof install in my book.
     
  9. eurob

    eurob master tile and stone installer

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    That sucks . I thought you could see it in the photo where the tub is sitting on the 2x4 -- excessive curving -- , but sometimes photos are not reliable . So the outer lip is much higher then the inside one .

    What stone will be installed for this undermount ?
     
  10. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    Design Work World Wide: Bathrooms Vancouver Area
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    North Vancouver, BC
    I did but when I disconnected the air switch I looked deeper under all the framing to see the plumber used scrap lumber as shims and they do not rest on the tubs four feet locations.

    I'm going to cram in some 4-1 down there in a plastic sandwich. Shove the crap in with a scrap 2"x4"
     
  11. eurob

    eurob master tile and stone installer

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    I think , if you use something like SikaGrout 212 , it should work .
     
  12. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    For what? Supporting the tub? What does that cost. I can get six bags of 4-1 for like $30.00 maybe with tax.

    Or pick up some mortar mix for the same price.....

    Later Boys - got to go to work! :(
     
  13. eurob

    eurob master tile and stone installer

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    So John , what stone will be used ? Marble or granite ?
     
  14. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    Not sure. I'm only prepping the tub for slab. The window for tile. The walls for tile. Setting the ACO drain. Mud bed for tile.

    Noble Seal CIS outside shower.

    New flood test.

    Capillary break.

    And then my part is done.

    Cool home. Has an elevator going in! Nice touch
     
  15. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

    Joined:
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    Design Work World Wide: Bathrooms Vancouver Area
    Location:
    North Vancouver, BC
  16. jadnashua

    jadnashua Retired Defense Industry Engineer xxx

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    While John will likely have conniption fits, you could treat the tub like a big undermount sink, make sure to support it properly underneath, and use KerdiBoard for the structure and top and sides. You'd proceed very similar to the way they show building a counter and installing a tiled, undermount sink in this video . You'd get it ready in a fraction of the time, have something that is waterproof, damp-proof, rot-proof, stable, and reliable. If you're paying for labor, far less expensive as well. Or, you could use the more traditional ways and spend more to not get a more reliable result...your choice.
     
  17. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

    Joined:
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    Design Work World Wide: Bathrooms Vancouver Area
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    North Vancouver, BC
    Another Kohler Tub going in with the Under Mount Option for finishing.

    Builder's crew set 3/4" plywood level with the tub top. No room for cement board. Mortar. I decided I could not leave it as is so I set a layer of Hydro Ban Sheet Membrane down and sealed it to the tub.

    Looks better now....

    There of course was some seal gasket. Push Rod and 8+9 used as well in process.


    The walls are a combo of drywall and Denshield. One coat of Prim Grip on right now.

    Mesh is going to get tied back onto the walls with thin-set once my prim grip sets up...

    Change in plane from wall to tub deck will see Ardex 8+9 and then this will be brought up the walls 18" and over the Hydro Ban Sheet Membrane.

    The near side is tipped to the shower and acts like the shower bench....
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 22, 2016
  18. eurob

    eurob master tile and stone installer

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    Looking good John.

    It must be something similar to the Quartz -- the man made type -- .

    I am sure the stone guys are /were happy with the prep YOU did . I would for sure .....if all of them would be prepped like that ?! Well done .:)
     
  19. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

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    You know what I learned on this one?

    It might be better to set the screed level down a hair so the thin-set build up is less noticeable.

    The stone is sitting a good 1/8" higher than my tile trim. I'm not impressed.

    I'm going to have to clean up the thin-set mess and do a nice job chalking the bottom. Then it will look better.

    I'm going to refine this design on the West Van job. Going to try a radius arch with the plastic S profile. 3/16" white one. Set the screed down so the stone almost rest on the S profile.... I think this is better after seeing this one go in heavy. Rarely do I find stone guys even using thin-set to install. I assumed this one was going in tight with silicone or adhesive!

    I'm getting closer to a better system for these undermount tubs.....

    Too bad the industry has no guidelines to follow....

    And why do these tubs have such strong lips. If your going to sell an undermount tub make the top flat for %^&(* sake!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 22, 2016
  20. eurob

    eurob master tile and stone installer

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    master tile and stone installer
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    Why?! To have more controversial ( argue ) back and forth with the non hands on ones ?

    If they come up with a standard , they will probably call themselves experts in the field ........ I did undermount tubs 15 years ago ...... no one called me an expert !:D


    Good point ... but I think it is a standard , so water is returning in the tub -- from the flat area -- . I suggested once to add a piece of the same stone on the edge -- perimeter of the inside opening -- , but it was too much work , too expensive . If using 3cm slab , you can remove some material until it sits flush . It needs some convincing to make it happen !


    I like the idea of the recessed metal trim , only if you could make it work to be 1/4 or so recessed , you can leave it visible , part of a design . :)
     
  21. johnfrwhipple

    johnfrwhipple BATHROOM DESIGN & BUILD for both Canada & the US

    Joined:
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    Design Work World Wide: Bathrooms Vancouver Area
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    North Vancouver, BC
    It is visible now. I like the accent on this one.

    On the next one I choose white.

    I like your idea of the added stone. But then the stone guys would have to add on a sliver cut.... Hmm or I just design the tub deck different..

    Oh Man.. You just got me thinking out of left field again! Thank You Roberto.... I got an idea!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 22, 2016
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