Foot valve, stock re-plumb, or modified re-plumb

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DesertEaglePt50

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I have some issues with the well system. I would like advice on how to proceed. I installed a new goulds j5 double drop convertible pump less than a week ago to replace the same, 21 year old pump. At that time, conversion to a submersible pump was considered but not selected. Not everyone will agree with that decision, just understand that that ship has sailed.

The water quality has always been excellent. The only corrective measure employed is a calcite filled water neutralizer that is backflushed every 6 days. Typical for the area, the water is somewhat hard and calcium deposits are flushed from the hot water heater when drained.

We have never run out of water even during a severe drought when some of the neighbors wells went dry, including one about 40 feet away. That well was recently sealed off and a new one drilled about 70 feet away. This is why I am wondering if I should consider a modified re-plumb, although there are some differences between the two wells. The closed well supplies a group home with about 10 residents, whereas we maxed out at 5. Also, the neighbor told me their well was less than 25 feet down and the new one is not much deeper. The static water level in my well is estimated to be between 25 and 60 feet down based on the pump setup, specs, and minimum gpm calculated by filling a bucket. The neighbor only brought in one company. When our pump lost prime during a prolonged power outage, I called four well companies, and this company was the only one who told me that the well wasn't worth putting money into and recommended they drill a new well from scratch. It was drilled in the 50's.

The priming issue has worsened over time. Recently I realized the gauge at the pump t was reading different from the gauge at the pressure tank t. When I replaced the gauge, I could not re-prime without backfilling from the neighbors. I hooked an air compressor into the tank t to pressure test the system and found 2 leaks on the suction line, but the priming issue persists after the repairs. When I installed the new jet pump I added a full port 3/4" ball valve between the pump and the pressure tank (just for now) in anticipation of additional work being required. If I close that valve while the pump is running, the pressure increases to the cut out and the pump cuts in and out about twice a second. If I close (slowly or quickly) the valve when the system is pressurized and the pump off, the pressure plummets at the closed position. I open it before it drops below the cut in and the pressure returns without the pump running, not more than 2 psi less than before, maybe the same. The ball valve after the pressure tank works as expected.
The old pump was heavily cavitating and I had to drop the cut out pressure to 25 to let it turn off. The priming port was so clogged with black deposits that it looked like a dummy port. The internals of the pump head were roughly textured with rust. The new pump can hit 40 psi in about 60 seconds but not more, and reach 35 psi in about 20. I did a drawdown test at 20/35, and got 1.5 gallons. At those settings, the pump would kick on every 25 minutes without water use. The pump can produce at least 6 gpm at 30 psi, but I am waiting for a hose to thaw so I can do a more accurate test at the pump.

The pressure pipe but not the suction pipe has a coating of rust colored very fine deposits. I also found sand to gravel sized rust particles at the pressure tank t. Given the drawdown test results and the fact that the pressure tank is 27.5 years old (goulds), I would like to replace it when I inspect the t, but I am not sure how to do either without losing the prime in the well...which brings me back to the thread title.

The well pipes need to come up. Do I replace just the foot valve? Do I replace all of it exactly as it is, including the poly pipe? Do I lower some string down the well and maybe change the piping based on what I find?

Thanks for reading and helping!
 

Reach4

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How deep is your well?
How far down is your jet?
How much farther down is your footvalve?
 

Craigpump

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I'd probably replace everything, pipe, jet assy, footvalve...in for a penny, in for a pound.

Use brass instead of nylon or plastic fittings, sure they cost more but you're only doing this once and I think they have a better bite and seal better than nylon or plastic. For pipe, you'll want 80 or 100 psi because the lighter/thinner wall will help it go in the hole straight and not drag. I use a tail pipe between the jet & footvalve, that keeps the pump from over pumping the well & helps guide the pipes without beating the footvalve screen up.
 

DesertEaglePt50

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How deep is your well?
How far down is your jet?
How much farther down is your footvalve?
No idea. I am trying to track down the info. But I know the specs of the pump and the gpm at a faucet, so the depth of the jet can be estimated at 25-60 feet. That assumes a submergence of 5 ft, which I believe means the jet is that far under the static water level.
 

Reach4

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The neighbor only brought in one company. When our pump lost prime during a prolonged power outage, I called four well companies, and this company was the only one who told me that the well wasn't worth putting money into and recommended they drill a new well from scratch.
comment: I think you were saying that you suspect that the neighbor did not need a new well, and these same folks were trying to sell you an unneeded well.

Unrelated to comment: Did you understand what Craigpump was suggesting about a tailpiece? By having a long enough tailpiece, you can keep the pump from sucking air, even if the well were to run out of water temporarily. The tailpiece should be placed far enough off of the bottom of the well to not suck debris from near the bottom of the well, but down far enough that you don't run out of water needlessly.
 

DesertEaglePt50

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I'd probably replace everything, pipe, jet assy, footvalve...in for a penny, in for a pound.

Use brass instead of nylon or plastic fittings, sure they cost more but you're only doing this once and I think they have a better bite and seal better than nylon or plastic. For pipe, you'll want 80 or 100 psi because the lighter/thinner wall will help it go in the hole straight and not drag. I use a tail pipe between the jet & footvalve, that keeps the pump from over pumping the well & helps guide the pipes without beating the footvalve screen up.
AHJ uses 2009 IRC, which requires 160 psi rating for water service pipe or tubing underground or outside of the structure (2905.4). I will use 160 psi rather than 200 psi and brass connectors in light of your recommendation.

I will use a tailpipe to protect the foot valve. The well has never been overpumped. It may already have a tailpipe. If I need to add one, what clearance do I need to maintain off the bottom of the well? How short can I go, since tailpipes reduce the performance of the pump?
 

DesertEaglePt50

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comment: I think you were saying that you suspect that the neighbor did not need a new well, and these same folks were trying to sell you an unneeded well.

Unrelated to comment: Did you understand what Craigpump was suggesting about a tailpiece? By having a long enough tailpiece, you can keep the pump from sucking air, even if the well were to run out of water temporarily. The tailpiece should be placed far enough off of the bottom of the well to not suck debris from near the bottom of the well, but down far enough that you don't run out of water needlessly.
I am suspicious, but I thought it was relevant information. I asked craigpump a follow-up about the tailpipe, but you beat me to it :)
 
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