Farm house gutted, Plumbers weigh in

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & ' started by samoht, Nov 13, 2008.

  1. samoht

    samoht New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Hello,
    New member with a few questions about an essentially new plumbing system on an old farmhouse. I have submitted two pictures:

    1. FIRST FLOOR: I have a toilet located in the corner of the first floor that is difficult to get a vent to. With my current arrangement, the toilet can be vented either through the vanity or the washing machine line. The vanity has a 5 foot wet horizontal run between it and the toilet. The washing machine has a 16 inch horizontal run between it and the 3" waste line coming from the toilet. Each of these have 1/4"/foot or slightly more slope and a 2 inch vent. Is the inspector going to fuss about this wet venting? There is the main vent about 8 feet from the toilet, but from the toilet trap to the 3" horizontal line is about 32" of drop.

    2. SECOND FLOOR: I was reading that it is a good idea to wash the toilet waste line with an upstream tub or wash machine. I have the 2" tub line coming into the top of a wye laid on its side and the toilet coming into the 45 of the wye. Also there is a vent in the 2 inch line just upstream of the wye for the toilet and tub. Will this arrangement pass with the inspector? If not, what should I change. (Nothing is glued yet. The vanity will come into the top of the low heel 90 and will have a Studor on it for venting).

    Thanks for your help
    Matt

    Attached Files:

  2. samoht

    samoht New Member

    Messages:
    8
    And, sorry for the jack studs. The foundation is having some work done. Also, the electrical is a mess until I get the hvac ducting in.
  3. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    14,780
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    On the bottom picture, the toilet is not vented right, and neither is the tub.

    I can't see how the venting is being done on the top picture to comment.
    Please don't close this up without a plumbing inspection.
    Right now I see too many problems.
  4. samoht

    samoht New Member

    Messages:
    8
    For the bottom picture: I was having finding a way to put a tee or wye just after the tub trap and have the vent come up at a 45 degree angle and vent to the inside wall (same wall the tub's faucet will be on). Looking through a plumbing book, it showed a toilet vent using a 3x3x2 waste tee on its back just downstream of the toilet with a 2" street 90 to a horizontal vent running some distance to an available wall, then turning up and into the attic. Can you suggest another way of venting the tub and toilet? The toilet has a window on the wall it backs to, otherwise I would use that.

    I will take a few more pictures of the first floor to show it better.

    All help is appreciated.
    Thanks
  5. jimbo

    jimbo Plumber

    Messages:
    8,997
    Location:
    San Diego
    One big problem is that a vent cannot run horizontal until it is 6" higher than the fixtures it vents.
  6. samoht

    samoht New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Thanks for the information about the vent low vent. I would still like to be able to vent the tub into the interior wall that in which the faucet is located. I am having difficulty finding a way to do this and keep the tub trap high enough for ceiling drywall. On way would be to remove the street 90 from the trap and replace that with a 2" sanitary tee on its belly (where a trap arm would typically come in pointed down and connect to one end of the tub trap). The one end of the sanitary tee would point horizontal as the drain and the opposite end would be connected to a street 45 or 90 and serve as the vent. Would this pass code?
  7. nhmaster

    nhmaster Master Plumber

    Messages:
    3,189
    Location:
    S. Maine
    You can't lay a sanitary tee on it's back.
  8. Southern Man

    Southern Man DIY Hillbilly

    Messages:
    530
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Maybe he can drop the drain in the bottom picture to be all below the joists, then run his smaller vent lines in the joist space and if needed, through them.

    Attached is the allowable cutting and notching from our 2006 residential Code.
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2008
  9. Tear it all back out because it's wrong, and it's going to be a problematic plumbing system. Flushing the toilet is going to suck the lavatory dry.
  10. Southern Man

    Southern Man DIY Hillbilly

    Messages:
    530
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Methinks less drastic measures will prevail. :rolleyes:
  11. redwoodvotesoften1

    redwoodvotesoften1 New Member

    Messages:
    78
    Southern Man is smart i'll tell U.
    My outhouse wuz stankin reel bad n he helped me cut out a couple of moon shaped vent holz so the wind blues right threw...
    No more stank he's a magic man.
  12. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,308
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    My friend, you are obviously not too well up on plumbing code requirements. While there are several very knowledgeable folks on this forum that have pointed out some of your errors, there are still many ways to screw this job up. Like you, I'm a committed DIYer, but I subscribe to the Dirty Harry Principle that says, "A man's got to know his limitations." The trick is to recognize when you reach your limits and go for help. There are limits to how much help we can give on the forum. My advice to you is to have your drains and vents done by a real plumber. You will be time and money ahead.:)
  13. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,270
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    plumbing

    We have no problem advising on minor DIY repairs, but this is a major plumbing system, and as such is not a DIY project unless you know what you are doing. How a plumber would perform your questions would often depend on how he decided to do it AFTER looking at your building and the plumbing fixture placement. It is also the reason why we spend years in school to learn how to make those decisions. The second floor tub and toilet are not vented, and the vent you do have was a waste of time and material because it does nothing.
  14. nhmaster

    nhmaster Master Plumber

    Messages:
    3,189
    Location:
    S. Maine
    Honestly, if faced with what is there I would cut it all out and start over. Trying to re-work it is more work than it's worth.
  15. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,453
    Location:
    Connecticut
    I might reuse some of the long lengths I cut out.
  16. samoht

    samoht New Member

    Messages:
    8
    I made some changes and I will pay the $50 for a reinspection. Getting a plumber would put me time ahead, but money way behind. For those of you who offered help, thank you. To me, it looks like the toilet is vented through the vent in the 90 bend that goes from horizontal to vertical (the toilet being within the critical distance to the vent). All the piping is just fitted at this point, so no need to cut and scrap it.
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2008
  17. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,453
    Location:
    Connecticut
    You mean everything we see is dry fit?:eek:
  18. samoht

    samoht New Member

    Messages:
    8
    The plumbing inspector said to dry fit everything and get it inspected.
  19. samoht

    samoht New Member

    Messages:
    8
    Unless you have advice, please save your interjections for another thread. This is the "DIY advice forum". Not blowhard forum. Writing "thats wrong" or "tear it out" does not help.
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2008
  20. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,453
    Location:
    Connecticut
    The problem is that when you dry fit the connections do not seat fully. When you you cement the connections every connection is going to be between 1/2" to 1" deeper into the hub socket than when it is dry. Your pipes will be too short.

    Sorry if you don't like "Blowhard Advice" but You are messing up!
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2008
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