Constant Pressure Pump Flashing Green but No Water.

Users who are viewing this thread

TrapperMark

New Member
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Points
1
Location
Rapides Des Joachims, Quebec
Well collapsed as i posted earlier this month with that problem. We have struggled with that all winter but we had a little bit of water, enough for some of the daily use. Last week we ran out, as usual, got it back then ran out again soon after that. When it runs out the controller flashes a single red pulse, after powering down a while and powering up it then has enough water and everything is fine. After this latest episode the controller just flashes a single green pulse?? It is not frozen, had the driller up (it is a brand new well) and confirmed my work of nothing froze but were too lazy to pull the pump, which was the reason i got them up in in the 1st place, since i cannot pull 200ft myself. the driller figures there is not enough water but then cannot explain the green flash. i filled the well to the top yesterday and it still flashes green so what gives??? air lock?????
 

Valveman

Cary Austin
Staff member
Messages
14,583
Reaction score
1,296
Points
113
Location
Lubbock, Texas
Website
cyclestopvalves.com
Variable Speed pumps are designed to fail prematurely and are not repairable. And since it supplies water to your house, you are not supposed to have time to research a better alternative. The manufacturer wants you to just replace it quickly and pay the man again. It is just like any other computer. When it glitches, it doesn’t matter which lights are flashing, you are still out of water.

Your pump man doesn’t know anything either. The flashing lights are made to tell him what went wrong. But when the green light is on and still no water coming out, all he can do is start replacing stuff, at your expense.

If you have to pull the pump, go back with a standard single-phase motor and a normal RPM pump. Because those who don’t learn from this mistake are doomed to repeat it.
 

Craigpump

In the Trades
Messages
2,436
Reaction score
158
Points
63
Location
Connecticut
Your driller/pump man is screwing you over big time. It's a new well & a new system and he has an obligation to get it going again. Right now, not tomorrow.

First thing, Throw the VFD away at his expense and have a conventional pump with a Pump Tek installed until HE can come back and fix YOUR well. If he isn't smart enough to know if there's water in the well, find another contractor.

And people wonder why this industry has a bad rep..........
 

Valveman

Cary Austin
Staff member
Messages
14,583
Reaction score
1,296
Points
113
Location
Lubbock, Texas
Website
cyclestopvalves.com
And people wonder why this industry has a bad rep..........

Pump guys are not supposed to know how these things work. They are easy to sell because you can say they save a lot of energy, and the customer won't know any better. If you have any problems with them just see which light is flashing and do what it says. There is no need to have any experience or actually understand anything about pumps. At least that is what they tell us in the classes at the trade shows and open houses. :)
 
Last edited:

TrapperMark

New Member
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Points
1
Location
Rapides Des Joachims, Quebec
I called yesterday morning and i told him what went on and what needed to be done, no if ands or butts. His guys were up b 4 lunch and pulled the pump and it seems the pump generated enough heat to allow a small hole in the poly pipe to form just above the pump! They mentioned the head pressure and heat combo with the lack of water was the cause.. While i am happy to have water (that i put in there) if they would have pulled the pump in the 1st place on friday none of this chat show would have happened.. and it was a whole lot warmer than monday as well. But y listen to me i am just joe schmo.. I will be buying a Pitmann adapter tool so i will not be held hostage anymore, 1 thing i learned while building my home is i am far better of doing it myself when at all possible.
Valve man- i was really leary of the VP pumps but was sold on reilability. I am and was concerned about not being able to fix it myself unlike the old style deep well pumps that i have experience with. As luck would have it if i would have an old sytle system i could have T'd off and had a 200 gallon tank in my basement with a spare 3/4 hp pump i have as a spare from my old house to supply my needs, no sediment and much easier than 5 gallon water pails all over the house. That way i would have had constant water all winter and not be chomping at the bit for warmer weather for the driller to come up and rebore my collapsed well.
 

Craigpump

In the Trades
Messages
2,436
Reaction score
158
Points
63
Location
Connecticut
Something is wrong with that drive unit. They are designed to sense amp draw and shut the pump down so that it doesn't run dry and over heat.

In addition, if the pump got so hot that it melted a hole in the poly pipe, think of how hot the wet end of that pump got....
 

Valveman

Cary Austin
Staff member
Messages
14,583
Reaction score
1,296
Points
113
Location
Lubbock, Texas
Website
cyclestopvalves.com
How were you sold on the reliability of a Variable Speed Pump? Could they show you one of that particular model that has lasted 10 years, how about even 5 years? I think not. Before any VFD reaches 5 years old is obsolete like any other computer. They are already selling a newer model that is supposed to solve all the problems of the previous models. This cycle has been repeated constantly for over 20 years, and they still have not perfected the design of a VFD. That is because all the problems associated with varying the pumps speed are caused by the laws of physics. There is nothing they can do to eliminate harmonics, voltage spikes, resonance frequency vibration, etc., etc. They are getting better at Band Aiding these problems, but mother nature will never let them be solved.

Craigpump is right in that it should have shut itself down long before it got hot. But that would have meant the installer would have known the correct minimum speed to set to make that happen. The installer is not even going to know what I am talking about, much less how to accurately set the minimum pump speed that will produce the lift and pressure you need for your well.

They try to make the domestic models more user friendly, and many times they have no adjustments. Being able to adjust things like the minimum pump speed is important, because every well condition is different. Either the adjustment was not made correctly or there is no adjustment possible, which was most likely the problem.
 

TrapperMark

New Member
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Points
1
Location
Rapides Des Joachims, Quebec
A trusted friend has a vs pump and has not had issues since he had it installed about 5 yrs ago. Well driller when asked told me he does not get hardly service calls... I liked the controller side of it when it was explained how it worked, well atleast i did till now.

Still not out of the woods yet, it seems the driller guys "ADJUSTED" the pump settings, now it trips the pump into thinking there is no water if u flush the toilet or a big sudden demand. WIsh they would not have played with the settings b 4 making sure they would work fine! for f* sakes. Going to read up the manual that came with it but and hopefully it has an adjustment section. Any words of wisdom?
 

Valveman

Cary Austin
Staff member
Messages
14,583
Reaction score
1,296
Points
113
Location
Lubbock, Texas
Website
cyclestopvalves.com
A recommendation from a “trusted friend”, who has exactly one pump to observe in an area where water is very lightly used, does not mean it is a reliable pump system. I have worked with literally hundreds of thousands of systems in all areas of the world, and many in places where water is used 24/7 at multiple varying rates. I am not a narcissist. I only have one area of expertise. But I have lived and breathed pumps for over 40 years. I can tell you that the design criteria for any domestic size VFD is not to reliably deliver constant pressure to your house, but to extract as much of your hard earned money as quickly as possible.

The average life of any submersible pump is about 7 years and the average price is about 400 bucks. If pump manufacturers can get you to spend and extra $1500 on a variable speed system, that is as much as they would normally get from you in your entire lifetime. So who cares how long it last or if you are satisfied? They don’t care if you try something else and even switch to a different brand because they got your money, and have already moved on to the next sucker.

Now having said all of that I probably know more about VFD’s than the people who make them. So if you will give me the brand of drive you have I will see if I can help you with the settings. I have been replacing VFD’s since 1993 and someday you will probably need my help with that, so I am glad to start the dialog by trying to help with what you have been stuck with.
 

TrapperMark

New Member
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Points
1
Location
Rapides Des Joachims, Quebec
I have a franklin sub pack 75 controller and a franklin 5 gallon per min pump. Lately it still is shutting down after a flush but if i leave it alone it starts itlself up after about 5 minutes. i f i cannnot wait i just power down and back up again at my elec panel. this is just weird.. b 4 all this happened lately the pump was fine just never enough water.
 

Valveman

Cary Austin
Staff member
Messages
14,583
Reaction score
1,296
Points
113
Location
Lubbock, Texas
Website
cyclestopvalves.com
I can’t believe someone would push a variable speed drive on you with only a 5 GPM pump. It is hard to have a cycling problem with a 5 GPM pump. All you needed was a normal pump and a little 20 gallon size tank that holds 5 gallons of water. You would have some room to vary the flow with a 20 GPM or even a 10 GPM pump. But with a 5 GPM pump you probably don’t have enough water to keep the shower pressure like it needs to be even though the pump is basically running flat out all the time.

Since you have a “subdrive” you are stuck with a 3 phase motor. So you will either have to change it to a normal single phase motor, or keep the subdrive working as it converts single phase to 3 phase.

But you can replace the “sensor” with a normal 40/60 pressure switch and use a 20 gallon size pressure tank. This will take all the variable speed operation out of the system, and it will work like a normal pressure tank system. The subdrive is basically just being used as a phase converter to give the 3 phases that kind of motor uses. Not using it to vary the speed will take out a lot of the undependable nature of the subdrive.

Also if you need to replace the subdrive so you don’t have to replace the motor to single phase just yet, you can get a much less expensive drive, which can still be used as a phase converter from someplace like driveswarehouse.com. Last time I checked you could buy a drive that size for about 150 bucks.
 
Top
Hey, wait a minute.

This is awkward, but...

It looks like you're using an ad blocker. We get it, but (1) terrylove.com can't live without ads, and (2) ad blockers can cause issues with videos and comments. If you'd like to support the site, please allow ads.

If any particular ad is your REASON for blocking ads, please let us know. We might be able to do something about it. Thanks.
I've Disabled AdBlock    No Thanks