Coliform Present in My Well

Discussion in 'Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog' started by gmrules, Dec 18, 2009.

  1. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    In theory you're right but not in my rather extensive bacteria remediation experience.

    In your short time doing water treatment, how many Coliform bacteria contaminated wells have you treated?
  2. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    So if I'm following you, you're saying that any customer of mine that has posted in a forum and I replied to him/her before they bought from me, is a sucker. Actually IIRC, George and I talked or he posted somewhere a while ago but I doubt he will appreciate the comment.

    I just got off the phone (yes on a Sunday, I thought is was a customer) with a Canadian about Kinetico and the price and the BS he was fed yesterday. Something about 2+/- lbs of salt and 11 gals of water per regeneration but "no quantitative figures so he could compare to other softeners".

    That would be the total salt used in a given time, like a week, or, how frequently it would regenerate. It was the toy type Kinetico with the top of the control valve about half the height of the salt tank. He's supposed to call me during business hours tomorrow. He had been reading my posts too.
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    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Dec 21, 2009
  3. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Gary,

    Please note that the price for the pump at the link I provided was $195 plus shipping. I listed the cost delivered as $205 in my earlier post because that included the shipping cost to Eastern PA where I live. I actually purchased a pump from that site a few months ago--at the current listed price and the pump included the accessories. The accessories are included in the "standard" Stenner pump package which includes a pump, pick up, injector, tubing, and spare pump tube. Apparently you have never dealt with or used the Stenner pump or you would know this. Additionally, if you had looked at the Spec Sheet for which there is a link at the site you would have found the information that the accessories are included.

    While the web site link I provided is a good price there are other web sites that provide similar prices so I don't think it is a mistake or a quirk. What evidence do you have to support your opinion that "the guy has an error in his pricing"?
  4. nhmaster

    nhmaster Master Plumber

    Messages:
    3,189
    Location:
    S. Maine
    Didn't I elude to perhaps finding out why there is a bacteria problem way back when ?........

    As far as selling product goes, who cares? It's allowed here, everyone that has a link or a product is welcome to solicit posters so hey, all is fair in war and filter sales :D Maybe you guys will all try to undercut each other to the point where I will buy from you instead of my wholesaler.
  5. masterpumpman

    masterpumpman New Member

    Messages:
    729
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    It would be very unusual for a well 230 feet deep to be contaminated if properly cased and sealed at the surface, but not inpossible. I would mix 1.5 to 2 gallons of bleach with at least ten gallons or more of water and pour it in the well. This causes the bleach to enter back into the formation some distance. Then if possible after opening each faucet until you smell the bleach let it set for 24 hours then pump it off until you no longer smell the bleach. Then have it tested and tested again in six months and again in a year. The deluted bleach won't damage your CSV or any other appliances.
  6. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    You're making that up, you didn't see me say or imply anything close to that.

    Actually the OP called me on his own because he had shocked the well previously and had read this and other threads already.
  7. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    So your cash register doesn't ring when you work on the well to prevent a Coliform bacteria problem... I don't believe you do it for nothing. So your register does ring.

    Then I see you leaning only to fixing the well instead of selling treatment equipment. And that's okay but most people will not take the risk of your way not fixing the problem and then having to buy the equipment after paying a driller their money and getting nothing for it.

    You don't give them a written guarantee that what you do will solve their Coliform bacteria problem now do you?

    To you the "correct methods" do not include water treatment, and yet all States approve the use of the water treatment equipment that I sell to solve the problem.

    You're very one sided IMO. I understand it because you're a well driller and want that sale instead of selling water treatment equipment. And since you lean that way, you are against me selling to anyone. I guess you do that to protect well drillers or you're afraid someone in your area will buy from me. Personally I think there's enough pie for both ways to be used to fix the problem.
  8. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    I looked up my wholesale price adn I get a very good discount price but I couldn't sell it for that. I also looked at all the other brands of solution feeder pumps. I think he is probably buying a number of cases maybe once or twice a year.

    I wish you well with your solution feeder.
  9. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Don't you mean that you WOULDN'T sell it for that price? I find it unbelievable that you COULDN't sell it for the price.
  10. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Don't you mean that you WOULDN'T sell it for that price? It is simply not creditable that you COULDN'T sell it for that price.
  11. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Yeah wouldn't couldn't is the same thing to me Bob but not creditable? Obviously I have info you don't but...

    When you take my wholesale price and then his retail price, minus any credit card charge plus a transaction and other fees (like merchant account charges), any phone call 800 charge, your time and then pay income tax and both the employer's and employee's FICA taxes, if there is little to no profit to make at least a few dollars why would I bother just to be able to undercut another dealers' price? How about you become a dealer and see how you do at his price.
  12. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    No, really I didn't think you would, I don't see you as that selfless kinda guy.

    I also don't see you helping many DIYers here by constantly telling them to fix the well without any guarantee that that money will fix their problem.

    Many of them probably can't get a truck to their well to do the job anyway. And then you'd want them to see if they couldn't drill a new well. With no guarantee of better quality water there either.
  13. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    The solution feeder, in addition to being less expensive to buy and to operate than a pellet feeder, has been totally trouble free--no maintence of any sort.

    This is a BIG difference as compared to the experience of one of your customers with a pellet feeder as posted on your web site. I quote:

    "Today (Friday) was the 6 week mark when I should check the chlorinator pellet level.

    I had rubber gloves and goggles. I shut off the valves surrounding the hopper, drained the boiler valve into the magic bucket, loosened the lid, unscrewed the hopper connections on either side, and placed the hopper into the bucket. I removed the lid and saw milky water and lots of mush - NO pellets, just chunks and mush. LOTS of mush. I could not see through the milky water. So I poured out the water, put the mush into a pan, and inspected the pipe. I didn't remove the center pipe, but if you think I should remove and clean it now, I will. I already have the muriatic acid for the job.

    Anyway, I wiped off the center tube of the hopper, poked a toothpick into the #1 hole to clear it out, and just replaced it all without cleaning it.

    My one HUGE problem was this: NO WATER TO RINSE ANYTHING! I had to drag it out to the creek and do my best there."

    "PS - you weren't kidding about the strength of that chlorine. Just in doing what I did Friday, I bleach-spotted 2 shirts, a pair of jeans, a pair of shoes, and my carpet!!"


    And then that same customer had to order another $150 of pellets after using the system for only a few months. Again I quote from your web site:

    "CHLORINATOR:
    **I need to order more pellets; I just emptied my last 2 bags**

    I checked the level of chlorine mush again 4 weeks ago, and it had hardly moved. So I reinstalled (drained the water as well) the hopper and waited another 4 weeks. Last Saturday I took the hopper down to find it was COMPLETELY EMPTY of pellets! There was just a bare minimum amount of mush in the bottom of the hopper, maybe a quarter inch.

    I did the muriatic acid cleaning, replaced the pipe and cap, set to minimum dose (1), and refilled with pellets to the base of the cap, and reinstalled. Again, both sides of the piping to the left and right of the hopper were stained with red chlorine residue (flaky iron-stained material). Now this Saturday is my scheduled time to flush the mixing tank."
  14. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!


    As you know that was Mechitty, a self proclaimed paranoid young lady with a very handsome but poor handyman type guy and you also should have seen we were being humorous in our posts.

    Also, she didn't order pellets for months after that and we decided she didn't have the center tube in properly, recall she said she didn't remove it when she first checked the level at the beginning.

    So you love your feeder, my chlorinator customers love them too.
  15. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    You say that although you should know the bacteria is coming in with the recovery water of the well and really, there is no way to find and fix the source of the contamination, or that there can be multiple sources at any distance from that well.
  16. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Early on in this thread Gary Slusser put forward the following statement:

    "There are a number of different ways to treat your water but IMO the best is an inline erosion pellet chlorinator, 12" x 65" bottom drain mixing tank (equivalent to a 120 gal retention tank) and a backwashed carbon filter with a special carbon in it. I've been selling that system for many years and it has the least maintenance of any system, costs the least and has no moving parts. It also takes up the least space of any chlorination system."

    Subsequently it has been demonstrated that inline erosion pellet chlorinators are more expensive to buy and far more expensive to operate than solution feeders for chlorination. Additionally, data has been posted to show that inline erosion pellet chlorinators have substantial maintenance--more than solution feeders in at least some instances.
  17. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    My system's purchase price only costs more when there is no retention tank used with a solution feeder; which is very rare in most cases but nonexistent with iron present.

    The maintenance of a solution feeder with a 15 gal solution tank is much more frequent than the one time on average every 2-4 months (based on water use and how much of whatever is being treated) that my pellet chlorinator requires. And that maintenance usually does not take more than 30 minutes if that.

    Some of the people I sell the system to replace a solution feeder system that they are tired of baby sitting and repairing or the constant cleaning of the injector they've had to do to keep it working.

    Bob, using Mechitty's post to attack my equipment is not a true representation, and frankly I thought you were better than that.

    BTW, I thought you told me that you were a homeowner, do you sell water treatment equipment?
  18. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    What I have said is that getting the government involved might get the well condemned. Then the property is worthless. A better way to go is through water treatment dealers instead of well drillers such as yourself; or your buddy Sam Tyler.
  19. nhmaster

    nhmaster Master Plumber

    Messages:
    3,189
    Location:
    S. Maine
    Folks you can't buy this kind of entertainment :D


    Hey Cass, bout time to close the door on this one eh?
  20. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    The solution feeder system is less expensive to purchase. Your quoted price was $773 as I recall and the cost of a solution feeder system is $705--$205 for the pump including accessories, $15 for chlorine from the local supermarket, $450 for the retention tank you include, and $35 for the solution tank.
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