BW Ultra High Efficiency Energy Saver

Discussion in 'Water Heater Forum, Tanks' started by SemiHandyRon, Dec 25, 2009.

  1. SemiHandyRon

    SemiHandyRon New Member

    Messages:
    46
    Location:
    Fairfield, OH
    Anyone had experience with the BW ultra high efficiency energy saver unit, model EFR‑1‑60T1206EN? See it here: http://www.bradfordwhite.com/products2.asp?id=1&product_id=218

    BW doesn't list MSRPs on their site, so I'm wondering about cost.

    Also, the BW site says, "this model qualifies for the current tax credit of 30% (equipment and installation cost) up to $1,500." However, the www.energystar.gov site says, "There are NO residential storage tank water heaters that can qualify for the tax credit because none can meet the Energy Factor requirement of .82." Is BW right and energystar wrong?

    When I bought my HVAC system, the Carrier dealer talked me out of buying Carrier's top-dog efficiency unit--he thought it was overly prone to breakdown, given all the esoteric circuitry, etc. I'm wondering if the same caution would apply here.
  2. that must be real new

    thanks for the info...
    never seen one of these yet


    I will look into this one tomorrow..

    that looks pretty nice and is probably going to cost me

    my guess about 1600..


    I would prefer it over a tankless.....


    4 mag rods in this puppy
    a thermostatic mixing vale??

    does not say what the tank warranty is

    the only thing I think would be wise to
    flush out the unit bi monthly
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2009
  3. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,453
    Location:
    Connecticut
    Its a condensing tank water heater very similar to the Eternal Hybrid or Vertex type units...

    Except Bradford White makes it....
  4. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,491
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    heater

    Part of its performance comes from operating at 160 degree water temperature and a built in mixing valve to reduce it to a usable temperature. They are VERY expensive, but I could not give you the price for two reasons. (1). It has been a while since I priced one, and (2). I do not know what plumbers in your area add to the cost for a selling price.
  5. Runs with bison

    Runs with bison Member

    Messages:
    892
    Location:
    Midwest
    We are still awaiting the official EF ratings on the condensing tanks, they should be complete in early 2010. The manufacturers obviously believe they will qualify at .82.

    Can't say how trouble prone these might be. I imagine they will be similar to power vented types maintenance wise. There is usually a learning curve for installers and manufacturers on new tech, so being an early adopter is risky. Also, early adopters usually end up paying much more than when something becomes mainstream a few years later.

    As to price, what really matters is what the wholesale cost is. Plumber mark up on the tank itself is not a useful measure. What matters is how much in time and materials they need for the installation compared to a standard tank. It wouldn't be hard for a plumber to price these completely out of any economical range since they will be expensive to begin with.
  6. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,491
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    tank

    quote; As to price, what really matters is what the wholesale cost is. Plumber mark up on the tank itself is not a useful measure. What matters is how much in time and materials they need for the installation compared to a standard tank

    Unless YOU can buy it at wholesale, the wholesale cost is MEANINGLESS to you. You will pay whatever the plumber charges for the unit, regardless of what he paid for it. The time and materials compared to a standard tank are almost immaterial since it is basically just another type of standard tank.
  7. is it any good????


    redwood, you need to write an article on it..for your web site.

    do you know anything about it , are they any good

    being made by Bradford White is the best selling feature to me...
  8. SemiHandyRon

    SemiHandyRon New Member

    Messages:
    46
    Location:
    Fairfield, OH
    I've learned the hard way not to be an early adopter! "Cutting edge" too often means "bleeding edge" and all that. :cool:
  9. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,453
    Location:
    Connecticut
  10. Runs with bison

    Runs with bison Member

    Messages:
    892
    Location:
    Midwest
    IT IS NOT IN THE LEAST MEANINGLESS TO ME!!!. Responses like that gets folks scratched off any quote list. The basic cost matters a great deal. This squirreliness of hidden pricing does your profession a real disservice and drives away customers/creates DIY'ers. Heck, it gives car salesmen a leg up--at least I know their cost to within a few percent. ;)

    Since we don't even have a ballpark price for these things it doesn't instill a lot of confidence in getting quotes from plumbers.
  11. you are the man.....


    yep, you are on the ball.

    why did you not tell me about this one???..

    I was not even aware of this new fangled heater from Bradford white...


    have you ever gotten a price on one yet???

    I am getting the feeling that it is going to be my next toy
    to install on that gas meter down in my laundry room..

    I have been running my 75 gallon brad white for about 3 years now
    with that gas meter and should have enough data on my yearly consumption..

    I get the feeling its got to be cheaper than a tankless
    give better all around demand and efficinecy
    and probably about as good or
    better than that evian unit.....

    do you know of anyone that has one yet??

    Last edited: Dec 27, 2009
  12. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,453
    Location:
    Connecticut
    I haven't done one yet but I did check it out quite well at the supply house.
    I imagine the California crowd might have tried one of these being low NOx and all...
  13. I wllllet you know tomorrow


    I will call my dumb ass sales man tomorrow and
    get him to give me a quote and try to get me one for my house..

    it dont look too bad, and at 95% it ought to pay for itself before I die anyway...:D

    well maybe it will ..that all depends
  14. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,491
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    price

    Even if you knew the wholesale price of the heater, it would NOT change my price for it one penny. And if my wholesaler sold it to you at my price instead of the list price, I would scratch him off my list of sources. I do not operate like a car salesman. One reason being that I do NOT have a "higher up" in the back room who can keep changing the price according to your attitude, and still wind up getting the price he intended to originally. Your confidence in the plumber should be whether he can perform the job at the price he said he would, NOT what you think you should pay. And if you think your plumber is expensive, just imagine what he would charge if he actually listened to the gurus in the seminars and national magazines when they tell what we SHOULD be charging for our services, (usually twice or more what we actually do).
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