Basement bathroom rough in diagram feedback?

Discussion in 'Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice' started by gerryuml, Oct 26, 2007.

  1. gerryuml

    gerryuml New Member

    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    Taxachusetts
    Hey guys,

    I wanted to get your take on the following diagrams I have attached. One pdf is of the idea of what my new basement bathroom will look like and the other is a diagram of the piping I am going to embed in the concrete early next week. I am going to be cutting the concrete and digging a perimiter drain for my sump over the weekend and wanted to get the rough in set in before I refil over the sump drain lines.

    I am planning to only use the vent from the ejector pit to vent this creation, I wanted to know if that would not be enough or if I could go smaller than 2" piping to the shower and sink?

    Also, I was planning to get the plastic ejector liner at Home Depot. Does anyone have any experience with that?

    Thanks for your input!

    Gerry..

    P.S. I did look for similar posts but could not find an old one I ran accross about a year ago with a diagram of a rough in.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Oct 26, 2007
  2. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    27,255
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    piping

    That drawing is good as far as it goes, the problem is it does not go far enough. It does not show any venting, and the actual installation of the piping would determine whether it was proper or not, even if the drawing showed it was proper.
  3. gerryuml

    gerryuml New Member

    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    Taxachusetts
    trying to unerstand

    Hey HJ,

    thanks for taking the time to respond. I think I know what you are saying about the actual installation being correct vs a correct drawing. But regarding the venting I am not sure. The diagram points out that the ejector pit does have a 2" vent that runs up to connect to the main vent/sack. total distance for the longest run (bathtub) is under 10'.

    If I am missing something else please tell me and I will modify the diagram to show more. If I have to I will redraw it in cad and 3D to give better representation.

    Thanks again!

    Gerry..
  4. Nate R

    Nate R New Member

    Messages:
    472
    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Would it be better to have 1 1/2" for that whole run? I've often heard here that going bigger can slow things down which wouldn't keep it from clogging up any better.
  5. markts30

    markts30 Commercial Plumber

    Messages:
    630
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Even with an ejector you need venting on the individual fixtures...
  6. gerryuml

    gerryuml New Member

    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    Taxachusetts
    1 1/2" for the run,

    Hey Nate, I am not sure about useing the 1 1/2" for the whole run. I just know that a plumber I spokd with a month or so ago recommended doing 2" everywhere because it makes thigs flow a lot easier (shrug). Also, the local "pro" at the big box store said that if I had a 2" vent that I could go up to 10' away from any fixture for venting. I Can Not do a vent on the bathtub as it would require me to lower the ceiling because the vent would need to run in that direction, in turn making the low basement ceiling almost too low.

    What if I did a 2" on the sink? would that be enough to serve the sink and tub? the toilet is almost ontop of the ejector pita as it is.
  7. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    27,255
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    drains

    Depending on how the piping is actually installed, the sink or tub could be 6" from the toilet, pit, 2" vent, or anything else and still need its own vent. The pit vent is not the vent for the toilet or the other fixtures. And getting plumbing advice from a person working in the plumbing aisle at one of the DIY stores, can be worse than no advice at all. Oversized drain lines CAN cause problems but undersizing them can create even more problems. Stick with the 2" drain lines. Vents can be 2" or 1 1/2" depending on what they are venting.
  8. no to 10' bathtub drain length. To resolve this, plan your tub drain route differently, by sending it to a vented sink drain where it gets combined there. Whether the tub drain line is 2" or 1.5" is not your biggest concern. Listen to hj. Both his points.

    Show the diagram to truly knowledgeable people in your city. Local codes count. Whether you must put another vent for the tub just before the connection to the drain (which is vented) from the sink, will depend on that.

    david
  9. FloridaOrange

    FloridaOrange Plumbing Designer

    Messages:
    1,317
    Location:
    SW Florida
    Pretty sure patrick and grumpy are in MA, hopefully on or the other will chime in.
    I think MA allows wet venting which would allow you to vent at the sink for all three fixtures. The tub would have to be within 6' of the lav branch (FL wet venting anyway).
  10. patrick88

    patrick88 Plumber

    Messages:
    836
    Location:
    Webster Ma.
    I would wet vent the drains. Run the tub to the 2" lav drain and run a 2" vent from the lav to the pit vent.

    Oh ya that pit in your pic is not for the job your doing. Sewage ejectors don't have 1.5" drains or vents. Sewage pits are always 2" vents and drain discharge. That my friend is a sump pump pit.

  11. gerryuml

    gerryuml New Member

    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    Taxachusetts
    Update

    Patrick, David, FloridaOrange, HJ.

    Thanks all you guys for your feedback. Here is an update.

    Patrick – I checked, there are three holes on the op of the pit cover, a small bushing sealed hole for the electrical cord and two 2†holes for ejector line and vent – (that was my mistake thinking one hole was 1 ½†as I looked at it quickly earlier today and one looked smaller than the other). There is also a 4†hole in the side of the pit liner with the center of the hole at approximately 11†down from the top. The name on the side says it is a “Flowtech sewage basinâ€. Is this an OK pit liner or should I get a better one somewhere else? I got this one at Home Depot.

    Advice from a “pro†in the box store isle – I agree, that is often worse then no advice at all, sometimes they know what they are doing, other times they make things worse.

    I have updated the diagram to reflect the changes and new 2†vent and moving some piping. Constructive criticism is welcome as I’m eager to hear what you have to say

    Finally, what is a good ejector make?

    Thanks again for all your input guys, I appreciate your helping me to do this job right that I could not otherwise afford if I had to pay someone to do it.

    Gerry..

    Attached Files:

  12. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    27,255
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    drain

    That vent does not service the sink trap. You need a vent for it also.
  13. Herk

    Herk Plumber

    Messages:
    547
    Location:
    S.E. Idaho
    I'm guessing you're BOCA code, and I don't know what that code says about venting a sump. But here, with the UPC code, a sump MUST have it's own vent through the roof.

    A sump is not like other fixtures - the pump moves water very quickly and requires that air in the tank be replaced just as quickly.

    I have seen improperly plumbed sumps, and have witnessed the results - every time the sump runs, it pulls the water out of a toilet trap.

    Also, in the UPC code, all drains beneath the floor must be a minimum of 2". A toilet vent or vent for a small bathroom group must also be 2" minimum. Every pipe that goes into the floor must have a full-sized cleanout above floor level. Horizontal venting is only allowed when structural conditions make it necessary, and although they're allowing a wet-vent for the closet, that doesn't include the shower.

    But BOCA is different. I don't have a recent book, so I won't comment on it.
  14. patrick88

    patrick88 Plumber

    Messages:
    836
    Location:
    Webster Ma.
    That looks good, but you really want to put the vent right behind the lav sink. That would be like so: Lav drain into "P" trap into the wall with a tee wye vent up water down. All 2" in the floor. Pick up the bath with a wye and over to the toilet.
    Send the vent from the lav over to the pit vent well above the lav sink. If you tie the lav vent any other place will make the lav trap into a "S" trap and would be wrong.

  15. gerryuml

    gerryuml New Member

    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    Taxachusetts
    update

    HJ, Herk, Patrick88. Thanks again for the input.

    From what everyone is saying it sounds like if I do what Patrick suggests that I should be in good shape./ I will update the drawing and report for final input.

    Again, thanks for all the info!

    Gerry..
  16. gerryuml

    gerryuml New Member

    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    Taxachusetts
    New Diagram incorporating changes

    Ok Gang, here we go. I think I have the plan the way we want it. I have made some changes and noted everything on the diagram I could think of. The dotted line is the vent above the floor. I tried to do this in autocad 3D but I'm not that good yet. so if I did not describe anything well enough please ask questions.

    Thanks!

    Gerry..

    Attached Files:

  17. doubletrouble

    doubletrouble New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    Menominee Michigan
    When I googled my basement plumbing question this post came up and caught my eye because it is very similar to what I want to do.
    My question is, why was it so important that the vent be moved directly behind the lav sink, yet the shower?tub has no vent & is a longer run?
    Thanks,
    Mike
  18. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    27,255
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    vent

    The vent does NOT have to be directly behind the sink, but it MUST rise up from the sink connection. One possible glitch would be if your jursidiction does not allow a six foot long tub drain before it reaches the vent point. Here, we are limited to 4'.
  19. doubletrouble

    doubletrouble New Member

    Messages:
    2
    Location:
    Menominee Michigan
    Now I get it . Because it's the highest fixture! Thanks!!
Similar Threads: Basement bathroom
Forum Title Date
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice Basement Bathroom Toilet Flush Issues Yesterday at 6:50 AM
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice Basement bathroom install - cleanout? Oct 21, 2014
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice Basement Bathroom with Ejector - Is existing plumbing to code? Oct 10, 2014
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice How to best ballpark price for a new basement bathroom? Jul 28, 2014
Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice Vent issue new basement bathroom Jul 23, 2014

Share This Page