AO Smith 40gal Gas for $**** installed

[tommygunn]

My gas heater; at 18 years old, is on it's last legs. A local plumber has offered me an 40gal/6yr AO Smith gas water heater for $*** installed, with removal of old. This is a year round condo that we own as a vacation home, and it is used probaly 12 - 15 times per year. While I realize this is probaly one of AO Smith's contractor units (and at the lower end of the range), my question is whether it is a decent unit to buy for the amount of use we put on it.

I had purchased a Lowes 40gal Whirlpool heater, but after reading all of the problems with those types, I took it back.

We do have an AO Smith on our home, and it is 3 years old, and runs flawlessly.

Thanks for any help anyone can offer

 

[Jimbo]

Whirlpool is made by a division of AO Smith, but the Smith branded units are not included in the class action suit, as far as I know.

Frankly, @ $**** installed, I wonder if he is selling you a used unit. That price does not leave much for him!

 

[Sponsor]

 

[SewerRatz]

Heck i can not even buy a AO Smith at that price. Give me his number I will have him purchase a bunch for me and drive them up to me.

 

[Dunbar Plumbing]

He's putting in a warranty tank from another job.


Hrmm...have I ever done that before?


Mmmmm........mmmmmaaaaaybe!

 

[Thatguy]

This is a year round condo that we own as a vacation home, and it is used probaly 12 - 15 times per year.

my question is whether it is a decent unit to buy for the amount of use we put on it.

As opposed to the heating element coming on 1000 to 2000 times/year, including 5 min every 7 hours just to maintain the setpoint?
Are you looking for an "intermittent duty" water heater?

 

[Dana]

As opposed to the heating element coming on 1000 to 2000 times/year, including 5 min every 7 hours just to maintain the setpoint?
Are you looking for an "intermittent duty" water heater?

Uh, dude, a GAS water heater doesn't HAVE a heating element!

But it would seem "intermittent duty" is really what he's looking for. The standby losses of atmospheric-drafted tanks are atrocious, so to leave it on when nobody is around would waste quite a bit of fuel (100 therms/year, at LEAST).

But the recovery times are quite reasonable compared to electric tanks, so turning off the gas (and water) supply to it before you take off, and turning it all back on as one of the first things you do upon arrival is probably worthwhile.

This is the sort of application that screams for a tankless on-demand (even a crummy atmospheric drafted unit with a standing pilot like a Bosch 1600P, which should be cheap to install), since the standby losses are next to nil while you're there (the pilot light- thatzit), and it won't won't grow stuff in it if you turn it completely off when you leave like a tank might. In a condo you don't usually fill the hot-tub, run laundry and take a shower all at the same time, so it doesn't have to be a 199kbtu burner to keep up. (100-125KBTU/hr is probably just fine, even in colder areas, and probably won't need fatter gas piping.) With intermittent weekender type use it would go 50+ years (bet the 6y.o. tank doesn't last a decade- 15 years tops.)

 

[Thatguy]

Uh, dude, a GAS water heater doesn't HAVE a heating element! 1

(100-125KBTU/hr is probably just fine, even in colder areas, and probably won't need fatter gas piping.)2

it won't won't grow stuff in it if you turn it completely off when you leave like a tank might 3

1 The dude stands mostly corrected. However, in a broad sense, it's the ". . .component of a heater or range that transforms fuel or electricity into heat"
2 1 therm/hr with 80F temp rise gives 2.5 gals/min forever, but I could never get used to the clicking as the thing tries to keep up with demand.
3 I'll have you know there were and are world leaders who very likely grew up in unused water heater tanks.

 

[Dana]

.
3 I'll have you know there were and are world leaders who very likely grew up in unused water heater tanks.

Is THAT what's growing in your cup!?!



(Who knew?)

 

[Mario]

My gas heater; at 18 years old, is on it's last legs. A local plumber has offered me an 40gal/6yr AO Smith gas water heater for $425 installed, with removal of old

There is something fishy about that price for sure.

Wholesale prices for the newer design federally mandated sealed combustion units are $****...no matter the brand.
Include a small percentage mark-up to retail price, permit fees for local inspections, misc. parts to hook it up, and two to three hours labor.
That should put the total install price around $**** minimum.
That doesn't even include any required code upgrades such as drip pans being piped for installation on wood floors etc....

If they are doing it for any less than this amount, they are either not licensed, not pulling a permit, not bringing it up to current codes.....or most likely all three.
That can be very dangerous for your family. There is a reason plumbers have to get licensed.
A water heater improperly installed could kill you in your sleep several different ways.
Carbon-monoxide poisoning, gas explosion, fire from ignition of combustibles....just to name a few.

If they purchased the unit wholesale, at that your talking three hours labor for seventy-five to one hundred dollars....
That says "shade-tree" right there.
Or like somebody already said..."installing a unit received from a warranty claim belonging to someone else."
That could be insurance fraud. Look out. Nothing good will come from this.

Even if they are licensed and are offering a total install for $****....codes change a lot over 18 years.
They may be taking a leaf out of Home-boy's and Lowe-life's playbook...(prices do not include applicable permit fees or any work to bring unit up to current local codes if required)
Planning to make up the difference on required code upgrade work and inflated permit fees not mentioned in the price.
They say the devil is in the details...

"If it seems too good to be true..."

 

[SewerRatz]

There is something fishy about that price for sure.

Wholesale prices for federally mandated sealed combustion units are $****...no matter the brand.
Include permit fees for local inspections, misc. parts to hook it up, and two to three hours labor.
That should put the total install price around $**** minimum.
That doesn't include any required code upgrades such as drip pans on wood floors etc....

If they are doing it for any less than this amount, they are either not licensed, not pulling a permit, not bringing it up to current codes.....or most likely all three.

Even at that your talking three hours labor for seventy-five dollars....
That says "shade-tree" right there.
Or like somebody already said..."installing a unit received from a warranty claim belonging to someone else."

That would be insurance fraud. Look out. Nothing good could come from this.

"If it seems too good to be true..."

I need to find a new wholesaler. My cost is a lot more than what you quoted. I had a call today I gave a price and the guy said he had someone else $700 cheaper than my quote. Which if I did the job for $700 cheaper I would not even be selling the heater for what I paid for it.

 

[Mario]

I like that name...Sewer rats. And the artwork. Never thought of that one.
That would make a great name for a plumbing company.

Of course "S" is quite a ways down the alphabetical line.
My company starts with an "A" too.

 

[SewerRatz]

I like that name...Sewer rats. And the artwork. Never thought of that one.
That would make a great name for a plumbing company.

Of course "S" is quite a ways down the alphabetical line.
My company starts with an "A" too.

Our company started off of Archer Ave. in Chicago. I always like the way my uncle came up with his name. He wanted to get into the polish neighborhoods, so he was go through all sorts of things trying to come up with a great name. Then he seen this record album by the band ABBA, he like how Abba sounded to him so he then add lin-ski to the name Abba and ended up with Abblinski and Son.It really worked out for him.

The name SewerRatz, is something that morphed over the years. Back in High School I used to have a pet rat that went everywhere with me. People used to say hey here comes Ron and the rat, that got shortened down to RonRat. When I started in plumbing I really enjoyed clearing sewer mains, so they started to call me Sewer Rat. I used the handle SewerRat on IRC and many other chat room types for years. Then I started to play an online game and the nickname SewerRat was taken and so was SewerRats, so thats how I ended up with the "z" at the end of SewerRatz. A lot of mu close friends just call me Rat now.

 

[Cass]

Maybe the OP misunderstood the plumber and the plumber said he would install a heater for $****...+ the heater...

With a parts and labor price of $**** something doesn't add up....

 

[hj]

heaters

Even "warrantee heaters" go in at the regular price. I could make real money if I could charge my price for the installation and pay him to do the job.

Just like the roofers bidding on reroofing the church. The first guy was a Spaniard and bid $10,000. When asked how it broke down, he said, "$5,000 labor and $5,000 materials". The second roofer was an American and he bid $15,000. When he was asked for a breakdown, he said, "$5,000 labor, $5,000 material, and $5,000 profit." The third roofer was Italian and he bid $30,000. When questioned he said, "10,000 for me, $10,000 for you, and $10,000 to pay the Spaniard to do the job".