American Standard tank warped ... problematic flush valve

Discussion in 'Toilet Forum discussions' started by Lakee911, Jun 2, 2008.

  1. Lakee911

    Lakee911 I&C Engineer (mostly WWTP)

    Messages:
    1,328
    Location:
    Columbus, OH
    My neighbor asked me to fix her toilet. It's an american standard toilet (not a champion). Long story short, the flush valve was leaking and three bLowes trips and 8 bowl-tank removals and reinstalls later, I discovered that the bottom of the tank is slightly convex.

    When I install the flush valve, it conforms to the bottom of the tank and the flapper seat becomes warped. So, the plastic flapper won't seal completely. The old one was completely rubber and it had started leaking, but it was able to better conform to the seat.

    I went out and got a brass flush valve, because I thought that it wouldn't deform and the gasket would take up the space. Unfortunately it wasn't the right kind ... it was a douglas valve or something ... so I couldn't use it.

    I reinstalled the original parts and it still leaks. Anyone have a solution?

    Thanks,
    Jason
  2. get another toilet...

    get another toilet.....

    American standard are JUNK....


    with oh--- so--- special over flow assembiles,

    and with other bastard parts here and there,

    you are not gonna win....
  3. hj

    hj Moderator & Master Plumber Staff Member

    Messages:
    26,831
    Location:
    Cave Creek, Arizona
    tank

    What kind of flush valve are you using? A Douglas valve is the generic flush valve. Most flush valves will or can use a rubber flapper. You may have created your own problem by changing the flush valve needlessly.
  4. Gary Swart

    Gary Swart In the Trades

    Messages:
    7,359
    Location:
    Yakima WA
    American Standard bites again. This is a very good example of how companies with well know names from the past have sold out, and the sleaze bags that bought the name are now producing garbage. They know there is a large DIY market that recognize the name and assume it is still a quality brand. Of course the pro don't buy them, they can't afford the time to take back faulty products, but the unsuspecting DIYers keep them in business.
  5. Lakee911

    Lakee911 I&C Engineer (mostly WWTP)

    Messages:
    1,328
    Location:
    Columbus, OH
    I bought one of those PlumbPak brands of plastic flush assemblies. Maybe my douglas style was missing parts or something. It was the last one on the shelf and there was no way to attach any kind of flapper to it. :(

    My neighbor isn't too too worried about now knowing that it won't damage anything other than waste water.

    Jason
  6. Buy Cheap, Get Cheap. Serves you right.

    Problem #1: You're shopping at the home centers and buying all the junk and seconds/blems that don't pass inspection for sale at supply houses.
    Problem #2: American Standard sold out long time ago and has been producing garbage for a while now. Look at the country of origin, the "good" ones are made in Mexico, the rest are now various third-world South American countries, I think Dominican Republic is in there now as well as China.

    You get what you pay for. Spend cheap, get cheap. At some point you'll get tired of wasting time and trips to Cheapo Depot or Blowes and you'll break down and call a plumbing professional to go out there, install a real toilet, with a real workmanship and product warranty and you won't have to worry about it any more.
  7. Mikey

    Mikey Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek

    Messages:
    2,718
    Location:
    Central Florida
    If I had a nickel (or better, a few bucks) for every professional tradesman's truck I see parked in the Big Box lots, I'd be rich...
  8. Suggestion: Keep in mind the names of those contractors who are shopping at the home centers....and never call or recommend them.
    Why support the big box stores? Their predatory pricing is putting supply houses out of business, they offer installation services that take money out of the pockets of licensed professionals and the hacks that they hire to do the installations are paid poverty wages.
    When I need electrical, I go to the electrical supply house. When I need lumber, I go to the lumber yard, and when I need my plumbing supplies, I go get pro-grade products at the plumbing supply house. No cart, no shopping, no waiting in line to check out. I hand them my list, they pull my material, they load it into my van. The home centers rarely carry anything that I can't find elsewhere.
  9. Terry

    Terry Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,130
    Location:
    Bothell, Washington
    I buy my lumber at Dunn Lumber in the Seattle area.
    I like working with the good stuff.

    I don't buy plumbing stuff at the boxes,
    But I do get tools, screws, bolts, concrete anchors, wet vacs there.
    Okay, I did get some lawn furniture too.
  10. Mikey

    Mikey Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek

    Messages:
    2,718
    Location:
    Central Florida
    A while back, I had to buy some electrical supplies that HD didn't carry. I tried a local supply house. They were very helpful, prices in some cases were better than at the box stores. They've got a new, albeit small, regular customer.

    Tried to buy my first Toto Drake at a local national-name house a couple of years ago. They didn't stock them, and weren't interested in ordering one without a big special-order charge and shipping charge. When I asked a question about a fitting I couldn't find, they told me to go to Lowe's. So I did, and have never gone back to them.I'm scouting around for a lumberyard now. A big problem with all the commercial houses is that they aren't open on weekends and in the evening, when I usually get around to shopping -- a habit left over from pre-retirement days.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 11, 2008
  11. Squ1rrel

    Squ1rrel New Member

    Messages:
    69
    Location:
    Texas
    What scares me is, when I went to a home show for million-dollar luxury homes this weekend, EVERY SINGLE HOME but one used low-end Cranes. Now THAT is over-pricing, IMO
  12. Redwood

    Redwood Master Plumber

    Messages:
    7,450
    Location:
    Connecticut
    "Million-dollar luxury home" and million dollar quality home are 2 different animals! One says look at me I'm a million dollar home and the other you would never know it until you look close and realize its a nice home with the best of everything. Kinda like the difference between old money and new money.:cool:
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