A Simple question.....Why is there more than one code for plumbing!

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Rich B

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I am a general mechanic all my life. I am 62.....Worked in the Automotive field for many years. I have worked in the electro-mechanical field for nearly 20 years. Welders-Generators-related equipment-service-repair-installations.....

I find it amusing that plumbing has to be done according to a CODE.....

but the code is different depending where you are and how it's interpeted?

How can this be and why is it so......

I see references to at least 3 CODES that may be in use in your area......This makes NO sense to me whatsoever.....

Plumbing will work the same in one location as another unless I am missing something.............

Climate is about the only issue I see changing in various areas that might affect how and what you use to do some plumbing work.

I worked as an Electrician right out of highschool for a few years. Electricians have one set of rules......

These rules have drastically changed over the years and so has a lot of the materials used but they still work under one set of rules basically.

Somone explain to me the how and why about the plumbing codes......

P.S. BECAUSE thats the way it is, is not a good answer.....LOL
 

Terry

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At one point, there was no code at all. And in many countries, there is no code. Try drinking the water there. You can't really do it.
In fact, the codes started here after a major problem with the drinking water and the deaths that occurred.
At that point, a code was written up, and adhered to.
Since we have fifty states, and many cities, we have many different additions and exceptions.
It would be nice if every city and state would agree; but they don't. But every city and state does have a building code, and that local code is enforced. As consumers, it's our protection, that the pipes buried in the ground and in the walls create a safe environment for our families. Without that, we would be like many third world countries, where they just throw up their hands and buy bottled water, suffer with sicknesses that we in the US are no longer familiar with.
When I travel, they ask what countries I'm going to, and give me shots for my protection, not 100% but better then nothing. I still don't drink their water though.
Rich, If you can get all of these cities to forget their stubborn little ego, then go for it. We as plumbers would love to have one code to go by.

For example, converted eight supermarkets to handle meat processing. Seems simple right? I had to meet with each local inspector and ask how they wanted the plumbing before I even cut the concrete slab. Eight supermarkets, and eight ways I plumbed them. But they all passed inspection.
 
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Shacko

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I agree with (Wally Hays) its the money, when you have a state with 10 county codes and city modifications and they all want you to pay for a license and a different code book, what do YOU think its for?
 

NHmaster3015

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And when you consider that the PHCC could have done something about it a long time ago.........well, you see.

If we had one code we could have license portability between the states so that you would not have to re-test in when you move. The apprenticeship could also be portable and consistent but hey, all that makes way too much sense. Truth is, there are too damn many guys "in the trade" that really have jack to do with plumbing and are more interested in fattening their own wallets and shoring up their useless organizations. The manufacturers of plumbing products and supplies infiltrated the interests of the trade a long time ago and we will continue to pay the price for their greed.
 

hj

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A couple of years ago, the two major code bodies DID have an agreement to merge, but when it was put to the contractors working under the IPC, they rejected it because they would have had to work to a stricter standard than they were used to. I have found that regardless of what the code says, if you install the system to the "HIGHEST" standard, it makes no difference what the code says.
 

Terry

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So many times we get asked how little they can get by with. It would be better if they asked what the "best" way is for the long term future use of the home or office.
I like to plumb like it's going to be my home. And I like to think that all the plumbing I've installed is doing it's job even now.

if you install the system to the "HIGHEST" standard, it makes no difference what the code says. hj
 
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NHmaster3015

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Oh I have got to agree with you HJ. They had cause also. It ain't called the Idiots Plumbing Code for nothing. 30 years of dumbing down and making the IPC more homeowner friendly has left us with diminished quality and dininished wages.

And I'm bitter about it. Damn bitter. You young guys should be up in arms because it's your job and your income that are directly effected. Would that we could all live up to the Cadillac driving plumbers that the general public thinks we are.

I say " Let no licensed plumber live in a trailer" :)

Kudo's to you also Terry. That is the "right stuff" indeed. I just wish more younger guys in the trade would get it also.
 
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Rich B

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Thankyou all for the HONEST replies. As usual $$$ talks and it sounds as if dollars rule this environment instead of common sense.

Of all the different codes....which one is the strictest and which one is the most leanient?

I live in New Jersey.....NSPC is listed as what is used here.

My home was built in the '50's supposedly......It's a real good example of why there are codes today for everything...not just the plumbing...

Everything does work and always has but it is very poorly built in every way.......

We deal with codes in our business that is similarly complicated.....Who has jurisdiction and what authority and rules are applied....

It is very clear cut though.....If life safety is at stake in anyway.......the highest standards apply...PERIOD! Any new installation is required to adhere to that set of rules.....and they get stricter all the time as in many of the other trades......

I had a Service changed at my house a couple weeks ago......Grounding was installed to meet the modern code and obviously it is a safety issue well worth the cost......It was adequate before but I can see the reasoning for what was added.......
 

hj

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As far as I am concerned, the Chicago Plumbing Code was the strictest, at least while I was there. IF I installed plumbing to the CPC, there was absolutely no question that it would pass inspection no matter where I was. In fact, when the local union tried to run me out of the state, someone asked them why they didn't like Chicago plumbers. The reply was, "Because they thing they know it all." To which the other person answered, "But they DO!"
 

Jimbo

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I think the codes arose more as a matter of geograhpy than anything else. Remember, there was no internet, barely even a telephone! And there just weren't the national bodies we have now. When a state or city needed a code, the easiest thing was to make their own. Today , of course, each of the national bodies has a vested $$$$$$ interest in their code...they get $$ for writing it, $$ for licensing it, $$$ selling books and training seminars. The biggest culprit is the NFPA! Try to figure out something in the fire and life safety arena. You will be bounced back and forth from NFPA 70, to 101, to several others! You have to have a huge , expensive library to work in that arena.
 

Rich B

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Jimbo....That NFPA 70 is the code we have to adhere to at some facilities we service. My service manager at work has given a slide presentation about it to our entire workforce. It's all pretty complicated and there are a lot of issues to deal with.
 

CollinLeon

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Of course, like most things these days, you can probably follow the money to see the reasons behind it... I suspect though that there could be logical reasons for different codes by different locales due to specific seismic or other conditions that they might have to be more concerned with than others. For example, Kalifornia has a problem with wildfires, so you do not find new houses built with wooden shingles, although I remember a lot of houses had them many years ago. I don't see them very often here in Texas, but I suspect that it is more of an issue of them just not being in style anymore. We get about 50 inches of rainfall annually here and with that much rain, wildfires are just not that much of a concern. We don't have earthquakes, so we tend to have a lot of brick veneer houses. Last time I was in Kalifornia, I did not see that happening on new construction. They tend to go with stick frame with either some type of siding or maybe stucco. When the ground shakes, bricks fall down... Siding and stucco give or maybe crack, but it is usually just a cosmetic fix... With regards to plumbing, at the very least, there is the issue of the depth of the pipes so that they will be below the frost line. I suspect it is also like with a lot of other things in life... They think they are right and everyone else is wrong...
 

hj

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ALL building codes are written by a committee of engineers. Now HOW could anything logical come out of that, when it already has two strikes against it?
 

CollinLeon

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ALL building codes are written by a committee of engineers. Now HOW could anything logical come out of that, when it already has two strikes against it?

The problem with a lot of engineers is that they never have to work on the stuff that they design. On the other hand, one could argue that the committe of engineers who come up with the standards are those who are not actually designing anything anyway...
 
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