7000SXT rebuild tutorial

Discussion in 'Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and r' started by ditttohead, Nov 17, 2012.

  1. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    [video=youtube;8YkJSSGQ0Rk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YkJSSGQ0Rk&list=UUL7f2aKKWBuAhzru29_Wv5A& index=1&feature=plcp[/video]
    Hopefully this tutorial can be helpful to some people. The 7000SXT is an incredibly easy valve to rebuild. For many service technicians, it is the preferred valve due to is high flow rates, extreme reliability, and it ease of maintenance. I can usually have one rebuilt in just a few minutes. I may be working on another video after the new year when I return from my vacations. Any suggestions? Maybe a 5600, WS1, Autotrol? Maybe even a simple media rebedding would make for a decent video.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YkJSSGQ0Rk&feature=youtu.be

    Check out the other videos on my youtube channel. Lots of entertaining items!
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2012
  2. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

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    How about a Fleck 9000/9100?
  3. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Thanks for living up to your promise that you'd post this, well done.

    If I may, I'll ask for a rebuild video of the Clack WS1 and offer an opinion or two about your 7000 video.

    You say the 7000 is "incredibly easy" to rebuild. I think it is as easy or as hard as any other valve for us guys that have rebuilt valves if you don't include the Clack WS1; which is hands down the easiest and quickest to rebuild bar none.

    You used a new valve in the video and not one that has been used, especially on well water with iron etc., for a few years but... I don't think you are looking at this from a first time DIYer's point of view. IMO that is due to you having no experience with DIYers.

    DIYers may disagree with you for a number of reasons and one big one is due to many of them being very nervous, anxious and afraid they will do something wrong or forget to do something or break something while doing it. I have extensive experience in actually speaking with DIYers on the phone while I have had them do the troubleshooting to determine the cause of whatever problem they are having and then I've been on the phone with them telling them what to do to replace parts.

    It will take them much longer than your all but 10 minutes including a couple of times where you speed up the video to save time. You say the special Fleck tools are not needed but then use one in the video saying it was to save time (which made it much easier too). You also stated that it is not easy to get the seals and spacers out and new ones in and that's after you probably have done it many times over a number of years and have gained confidence that a DIYer doesn't have.
  4. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    Thanks Bob, I will do a 9100SXT soon. I will probably do the WS1 first. The WS1 is a great valve, and it is easy to rebuild. The 9100 is based on the 9000 which has been the industry standard for decades for light commercial twin alternating and residential application that have excesively high hard water.

    As to the odd critique of using a tool to help rebuild the valve, huh? Watch it again, I installed a single spacer, not a seal with it, only because the spacer happend to be sitting on the tool, and to be honest, that was not even a 7000 tool, it was a 5600 tool so the spacer does not fit correctly on the tool anyway. I rarely do videos that exceed 10 minutes. I do training seminars on controls, these are typically 4-16 hours depending on how much detail the companies that contract me want. I just did a 7 hour seminar on the WS1 a couple weeks ago. Rebuilding, troubleshooting, programming, installation techniques, code requirements, etc. Even then, it seemed like I had to leave a lot of information out.

    The idea behind this video is so someone in need of rebuilding their 7000 can watch the video, hit the pause button, do as I told, then continue. It was done chronologically and accurately so as to allow someone to follow along. In order to go over the programming, spacer removal when high cloramine levels are present, iron fouling issues, etc, regardless of the valve, this would be a different video, or more realistically a series of videos. I seriously doubt someone needs to watch an extra 10 second of me turning a screwdriver to understand it properly.
    Hmm, a series of tutorial videos, not a bad idea.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2012
  5. ByteMe

    ByteMe New Member

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    I think it is a very good video. Makes me want to go out and buy a value to learn all the insides. From what everyone says, I'd really like to see that Clack WS1. If that Clack WS1 is so good, why would anyone buy anything else?

    Instead of me buying a unit, is it possible to get a company loaner for a few weeks to play with and then send back? Purely educational purposes. I don't want to buy one and then not actually be able to install it after I have learnt from it.
  6. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    Thanks ByteMe, this quality of video, as poor as it is takes many hours to make, edit, do the voice overs, etc. I appreciate the comments.

    The Clack WS1 is an exceptional valve. It is as good as any Fleck. It is more like a Ford vs. Chevy debate. Both are great, but some people have their allegiances and will nit pick everything to make their ridiculous point. I can speak to either valves problems and convince anyone who is not familiar with the valve that the other is a horrible piece of junk. I could talk about the seal materials, how one is good, the other is bad and why, the brine piston and how great it is to be inside the valve or how much better it is to be exposed like the Fleck. It is easy to argue either way, I prefer to be honest and just say both are awesome, extremely high quality, and if a person were to buy either one, they would not be dissapointed. I have my problems with both valves and both companies. These are all nitpicky little complaints that amount to almost nothing considering the positives of both. Their are many companies making terrible product for this industry, I prefer to save my criticisms for companies that legitimately put out junk products. If a valve is bad, i am glad to say it (the original Fleck 5000 electromechanical, and the Fleck ProFlo 8500 are good examples of bad products from great companies). Some of the early Clack valves had their fair share of prblems as well.
    The Clack is easier to rebuild, that being said, the 7000 takes 5 minutes, the Clack takes 4 minutes. Either valve only needs to rebuilt every decade or so. The ease of rebuilding, when both are so easy to rebuild is a silly point. I work with both companies all the time. I regularly work on both and considering the massive numbers of these products we sell, we are very aware of every little flaw and problem with them. For residential, I am happy with either valve, and even have the WS1 at many of my families houses. I have replaced a few recently with the new 5800SXT for testing purposes. The 7000XTR is my current favorite valve, but I will be changing mine to the NXT when it becomes available. Commercially, the Fleck is preferred by the majority of dealers due to their dual piston design for water softening. Clack only offers single piston designs which require external components to allow for duplex, triplex, or quad-plex installations with alternating, sequencing, etc. But... a single piston design i better for single tank backwash filter designs... For single tank applications, the Clacks are as good as any Fleck. Sorry if this is getting overly technical, I am just trying to explain fairly the differences betwen Fleck and Clack. I dont want to forget Autotrol, another exceptional product line that has been around for many decades. It has its own unique design flaws and problems, but in general, it would be the Jeep of the group. Still great, hard to complain about, just not as common. Both companies do a good job at customer service, and both offer good warranties. Considering where the Clack designers came from, and the design they based their valves on, it is no wonder that they are a good valve. I am sure that people will say the 5800 took some of the ideas from the WS1, but considering the WS1 is very similar to the Fleck valves, who copied who? Both, it is called progress and innovation. Both companies have done a great job at making the highest quality controls for the water treatment market. Clack adds a lot more restrictions to the sale of their valves, Fleck is following suit with the 5800SXT release, and will probably do more restrictions in the future. I agree with this philosophy, private companies that want to protect their market can limit who purchases and sells their product and how they sell it. This had led to a huge increase in Clack sales. Some people think their 100 valve sales a year is a lot and would matter to a company like Clack. It is not, and it does not. Clack is more interested in the market as a whole and their large dealers who sell thousands a year for a decade or longer. At least Clack and Fleck are not like the import companies that simply copy a mold, and put a different colored cover on it and call that innovation.
    My prognostication for the future,the 7000 will have some major updates coming in the next 2-3 years. I have noticed a few minor changes to the design that will allow for some exciting new functions and capabilities. They have already announced a NXT version of the 7000, and anyone familiar with the NXT programming can see the possibilities already with that design.
  7. Bob999

    Bob999 In the Trades

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    Dittohead:

    While I agree with you that both Clack and Fleck make excellent valves I see one critical difference when talking about valves on a DIY website. That is that Fleck makes its products, repair parts, and support documentation readily available through multiple outlets to DIYers while Clack no longer sells to or supports DIYers.
  8. Gary Slusser

    Gary Slusser That's all folks!

    Here is a youtube video of the rebuild of a Clack WS1. For those without the Clack tool, a common screw driver can be used instead and that feature is built into the valve body although you can't see it in the video. The injector and its screen are basically the same as those parts on the 7000. Motor removal/replacement is easier than the 7000.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqfQKEYASpE
  9. ByteMe

    ByteMe New Member

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    Midland Texas
    Nice one with the Clack WS1.

    I am also looking for a video that shows the regeneration with a clear tank. Anyone?
  10. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    I used to have a great video of that but it is about as exciting as watching grass grow. I will see if I can dig it up, I am guessing about a 50% chance of actually finding it.
  11. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

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    I have it on VHS and no, I am not going to convert and upload it because as Ditto said, It's like watching grass grow. Want to put a classroom full of students to sleep? Slip it into the VCR and wait 6 minutes.
  12. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    LOL, yup, I stopped using the video for training seesions at least 10 years ago.

    How about this, put the system in backwash, and the resin raises a few inches, stop back wash, it drops a few inches. tadah!

    The turbulator, the resin sort of spits out of the manifold upper piece and drops to the top of the resin, not that impressive.

    The vortech tank, not much different, resin raises, then falls.

    GDUK, the SP3 or Next media sorta moves and boils a little better than a gravel underbed.

    Now it would be interesting to do a large tank say above 48"'s with improper or poorly designed distribution and you may notice certain section acting strangely, interesting, but certainly not a video that would go viral.
  13. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

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    I'm interested in the subject but that would bore me
  14. ByteMe

    ByteMe New Member

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    Argh! Why are you pee'ing all over my parade?

    I was hoping to see a bit more than a few inches (insert sexest joke here) of resin lift. I found one by vortec on utube. It looked fairly cool but i expect their demo was not real world.
  15. Tom Sawyer

    Tom Sawyer In the Trades

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    If lifting resin excites you, you need to get out of the house more often :cool:
  16. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    hahaha, agreed. And you are correct, the vortech one is obviously "emphasized for affect". Watts used to carry a clear tank for demo purposes, but it was so boring and overdone at the trade shows that Watts stopped carrying the product.

    Now when people want a clear demo, I recommend they make it themselves out of clear PVC. When they see how expensive it is too make, it rarely gets done.

    The clear demos all use flat tops and bottoms. The lack of a dome makes the actual data useless.

    I am taking a break from water later this week, my daughter and I have lots of hockey practice, and we are in a parade with my Jeep. "BTW, proud dad moment and some bragging! My 7 year old daughters 8U Lady Reign team beat the Aliso Viejo boys team last weekend, 2-1, and my daughter had the game winning goal!"

    We have won the main award for the parade 3 years in a row, gonna try to win again. I will have the new display on my youtube channel in a week with any luck. We will be in the Wrightwood parade of lights if anyone in the Southern California area is bored on November 24th.

    ByteMe, I admit water treatment is exciting and fun, but like Tom said... :)
  17. lifespeed

    lifespeed Member

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    What are the differences between 7000SXT, XTR and NXT? Spacer removal for chloramine?
  18. ByteMe

    ByteMe New Member

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    61
    Location:
    Midland Texas
    Does anyone sell the clear tanks?
  19. ditttohead

    ditttohead Water systems designer, R&D

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    Location:
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    SXT is basic programming, XTR is semi proprietary with additional troubleshooting, diagnostics, output relays, etc, the NXT is being built to allow for twin alernating, series, system 6, system 7, system 14 etc. by using an external shut off. This has been available to Culligan for a long time, it will now be available to most other dealers in the near future. It is rumored to be available in about 2-4 months.

    Chloramine does a little more damage to the seals, it can soften them and cause them to "stick" to the valve. If you remove the seals and they do not come out easily or leave little bits behind,then a careful cleaning of the inside of the valve body may be needed.

    Clear tanks for sale? Not that I am aware of. Most companies simply build them out of clear acrylic tube, a couple flat plates and drill and tap for the valve. I have made a few out of clear PVC, the end caps are slighly domed which allows for the display to be slighly more realistic. They are extremely expensive. 8" caps are about $400, the 4' length of 8" PVC pipe is abour $300, then a drill and 2-1/2"-8 tap...
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  20. Mikey

    Mikey Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek

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    Might be easier to cut a window in a standard tank and replace it with a plastic insert, mounted on the inside, sealed, etc. Much easier to roll a piece of acrylic to match the inside contour of the tank than to form a dome, but not having seen the inside of a tank, I'm not sure about the sealing thing. While you're at it, you could place a few led light strips inside to light up the action. Get a comfy chair, some popcorn, and invite all the neighbors.
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