New flapper does not resolve leak from toilet's tank into bowl

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The toilet in question is 10 years old, however, details regarding the make / model are unknown. It is probably a 'contractor special' in 25 unit townhome community. That being said, water is leaking from the tank into the bowl. With 2 different flappers, I installed, filled the tank, shut off the water supply and let it sit overnight. The hope was that the water level did not fall. No joy.

Given that I tried two new different flappers, wiped down the plastic seat for the flapper, I am not sure if there is something that I have overlooked or maybe there is technique that I am not aware of.

I do not know the keywords to search on: keyword suggestions or links to other posts with similar (same) problem would also be appreciated. Hopefully, I have provided enough information, however, if there are questions that would help diagnose the problem I would really appreciate the opportunity to answer them. I thank you for your time to consider this challenge and truly appreciate constructive (actionable) suggestions.

[FLAPPER]
 

Reach4

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I suggest you search for flapper valve replacement
 

Cacher_Chick

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If you did not use the correct factory replacement flapper, there is a good possibility that it will not seal. Also, if the seat which the flapper seals to is not clean and perfectly smooth, the flapper will be unable to seal to it.
 

JMac

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How do you know it is leaking into the bowl? Did you do the dye test?
Granted, the same answers may apply, but knowing where the water is going would give better answers at first instead of throwing parts at it and hoping you get it right. Just saying...
 

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Thanks to everyone that responded! A comment in this article indicates the seal may be improved with a thin layer of Vaseline (Petroleum Jelly is my intepretation):

http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/photos/0,,20403832_20813689,00.html

I appreciate the good questions and will attempt to answer questions here:

@hj: all the water leaked out overnight. I expected that it would be all or none. If it was partial, I'm not sure what to make of that other than a really slow leak?
@JMac: No dye test was performed. I like the dye idea. The original flapper allowed a small visible trickle into the bowl. I did not observe a trickle with the new installed flappers: I assumed that when the water level went down that the flapper was not sealing properly. Water was not observed on the floor, so I reasoned that the only place it could go was into the bowl. Maybe this is incorrect?
@cacher_check @Smooky: good suggestions, a sponge was used to clean a (yechhh!) film off the surface that the flapper seals to. Not sure what that part is called. Bonus if you can properly name that part. Thank for the links.
 
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@Smooky: Kudos for clearing up the parts terminlogy.

If possible, I would like to minimize the amount of disassembley.

I am wondering if anyone has experience with a Toilet Selant Ring. I was hoping that it would broker a proper seal:

k2-_e6ae1af4-50a2-4206-a9f3-00f85790c2c2.v1.jpg


I am not sure if this is intended to be incontact with the flapper.
 

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Any thoughts on how the flapper is mounted: use of the arms vs collaring the pole?
 

Smooky

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Terry

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Any thoughts on how the flapper is mounted: use of the arms vs collaring the pole?

Collaring the pole is the worst method.
If you have wings on the overflow tube, use the wings.
the center part of the rubber that would slip around the tube, that gets cut off so that the flapper can "swing" on the pivots.
 

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@Smooky: Thank you: the http://www.fluidmaster.com/toilet-flush-valve-repair-kit.html resolved the leak issue.

I decided to replace the cock-and-ball with a fluid PRO45U because they were given to me. The video indicates to hand tighten the fill valve, however, it leaked so I hand-tightend it + a quarter-turn with a wrench. Upon successful installation I saw that Fluidmaster makes and ingenius fill valve that locks the float in the off position, and releases it upon the flush command. If you have experience with this device, I would appreciate any insightful comments.

Toilet fill valve locks float to prevent phantom flush: Float is locked until explicitly released by user.

 

Jadnashua

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On most toilets, the flapper valve sits up maybe an inch or so from the bottom of the tank because of its seat. Since the water emptied below that level, while it MAY also be leaking from the flapper valve, it appears to also be leaking from the seal that holds the flapper seat to the tank. You may need to take the tank off, but underneath it is usually a big nut that compresses the seal and holds the flapper valve seat in place. If the parts are all old, you may want to replace both the seal under the flapper seat, and the one that seals the tank to the bowl. ANd, since you'll have the tank off, you may as well replace the rubber seals under the bolt heads holding the tank to the bowl.
 
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