Need help with a shower drain in basement

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radkon

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Hey guys, first post here.
My layout is such:

1 1/2" drain to a 3" wet vent/drain stack that drains into an existing 4" PVC pipe under concrete. (see "hole in floor 2" pic)
3" toilet flange ties in under the concrete (can't determine how)
I would like to tie in a 2" shower drain to the existing 4" PVC drain, after the toilet. See DWV pic

Question is since everything is in a line do I still need to vent the shower? See DWV pic 2

Correction on "proposed drains" pic (the 45 degree 1 1/2 is a vent, not a drain)
 

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Hammerlane

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In your proposed drains picture, is that the location of where you want to put the shower? You will need to vent it. Where in your proposed drains picture do you plan to place the toilet? I am working on my basement bathroom and I wet vented the toilet off the shower. I minimized concrete trenching by adjusting my layout of shower, toilet and lav. I even went as far as doing the lav drain above grade since I had a stack close by. Here is a link to my layout if you care to look:

https://terrylove.com/forums/index....use-shower-vent-for-toilet.55690/#post-437693
 

radkon

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The toilet flange is visible in the proposed drain pic. It is covered with duct tape. Thanks for the advice.
 

Cacher_Chick

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The shower trap must be vented, and the vent must rise vertically from the trap arm. A vent cannot be ran under the basement floor as it would be plugged the first time there was a backup.
 

Jadnashua

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You can combine vents AFTER the individual traps are vented. IOW, one vent line can have multiple traps vented into it. THe overall size of that pipe would depend on what it is venting. EACH trap needs to be vented within a certain distance of the trap individually, and the combination method above them is pretty specific on how it can be done. Within a single bathroom group, you can get away with wet venting some combination of fixtures, but the details must be followed carefully.
 

Cacher_Chick

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The codes are very similar across the U.S., except for a few states that are more strict. Route the shower drain in such a way which allow you to pipe the vent vertically through a wall. A shower drain is 2", and you are allowed 8' max between the trap and it's vent.
The basement fixture vents can be tied together so that only one pipe has to go up through the roof, but the fixture vent piping must remain vertical until it is at least 6" above the flood rim of the highest fixture served
 

radkon

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So here is the current layout. 4" sadle tee to tie into the main. 2" P trap with 1 1/2" vent wye run up through the nearest wall and tied into a common vent. (this is just mocked up right now)
 

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Cacher_Chick

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A saddle tee is not an approved connection. You will need to cut in a wye a bit further downstream so that you can run a proper vent up vertically on the outside of the perimeter of the shower pan.
 

radkon

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So would you recommend something like this? I'm not a huge fan of an all rubber wye buried under a concrete floor.

611918018140.jpg
 
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nrphillip2

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So would you recommend something like this? I'm not a huge fan of an all rubber wye buried under a concrete floor.

Why not use a pvc wye which is glued in place. The other guy is right. Your vent needs to come off at a45 degree angle or higher to be considered a proper vent. If you vent it there where you have it currently you have to go horizontal to get to a wall to hide the vent pipe
 

hj

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You CANNOT use "saddle tees" OR rubber fittings. Inspectors and codes are ALSO not fans of rubber fittings buried under concrete, which is why you cannot use them. They do not even allow "Fernco" couplings, which are a rubber tube with hose clamps on each end, under concrete or inside a building.
 

radkon

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Why not use a pvc wye which is glued in place. The other guy is right. Your vent needs to come off at a45 degree angle or higher to be considered a proper vent. If you vent it there where you have it currently you have to go horizontal to get to a wall to hide the vent pipe
Not going to be easy to get a full pvc wye in there without cutting significantly more of the floor. The pipe is about 18" deep and about 7 feet buried on either side. Getting "wiggle room" is tough.
Any other options?
 

radkon

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You CANNOT use "saddle tees" OR rubber fittings. Inspectors and codes are ALSO not fans of rubber fittings buried under concrete, which is why you cannot use them. They do not even allow "Fernco" couplings, which are a rubber tube with hose clamps on each end, under concrete or inside a building.
I can understand not allowing them under concrete but inside a building? My father had a plumber tie into his main abs 4" stack and they used ferncos and it passed inspection.
 

Cacher_Chick

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It is best practice is to stay with the same material as the pipe. You can use fernco couplers below grade to cut in the correct wye. We break as much concrete as we need to in order to do it right.
 

Cacher_Chick

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That would be a correct installation. There is a torque spec on the clamps, and a persnickety installer would use it.
 
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