Fernco to CI leak

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tgl

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Attached a Fernco T to an old ci drain line, which now leaks from the bottom, since I stupidly cut the old pipe through the letters! Will sealant stop the leak? what type of sealant should I use?

Otherwise, I guess I would have to make a new cut below the letters, move the T down, add Fernco coupling and a piece of 4" pvc? But if the current Fernco is intended for ci, will it attach properly to PVC? Also, must I use a banded Fernco for the coupling? Thanks!
 

Cacher_Chick

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I would never recommend a flexible tee, but why not just use a grinder to smooth out the letters on the C.I.?
If the outside of the pipe is clean and smooth it will seal
 

Terry

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fernco_shifted.jpg


This is what happens to Fernco fittings after they are installed. See how much the fitting has shifted? Imagine with you had waster going through that, or if you needed to run a snake through that.
We have never been allowed to use those fittings. Somebody did here, and it looks poor. :(

mission_bandseal.jpg


These with the metal wrap will keep the pipes in-line.
 
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Breplum

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I recommend considering Fernco fittings as "temporary". They cannot be relied on as permanent under any lateral stress. A good example where they might be appropriate is their repair adapter for ABS hub to pipe at a sink stub-out.
 

tgl

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Listen to HJ.
Thanks, yes, I'm uncomfortable about the Fernco--but RE using a PVC T--I can't mate PVC to iron without the Fco transition, can I? (though I seem to recall doing this in the past, but it has been a while...)
 

tgl

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thought about a ratcheting strap support (or hardware strap to keep things straight just in case (used this when I cut the line in the event...

Btw how even does the cut itself have to be a tight squeeze and had to do one part by feel... should I go back over that with a grinder also would it help guide flow if I grind the inside of the pipe to a slight angle or inward bevel
 

Asktom

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You need a PVC san tee with shielded cast iron to plastic no-hub couplings above and below it. That rubber tee will buckle, as Terry mentioned, and if you ever put a snake down the drain it is liable to punch a hole in the back of the tee rather than dropping down.
 

tgl

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OK so I would first have to add a bit of 4 inch pvc to each end of the t, then the fernco no hub couplings is this right thanks!
 

Asktom

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Correct, you need a short piece of pipe in each end of the tee. You will need to fold back the rubber in the center of the couplings in order to have room to put in the tee and short pieces. If you cut the opening larger than you really need it will let you fold the couplings so you can measure and cut the short pieces to lengths you know will work.
 

Jadnashua

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FWIW, many people use the Fernco company name to represent a rubber tube coupling with two simple hose clamps as shown in Terry's picture...that is somewhat of a misrepresentation - Fernco makes all sorts of fittings, including the banded ones that would pass code for that installation, including nohub (which looks similar to the banded coupling) that is used to connect CI to CI. Fernco's banded/shielded coupling that probably would work out for you is their ProFlex line http://www.fernco.com/plumbing/shielded-couplings . Using a brand name to identify only one of numerous products from a company leads to confusion...either show a picture or use the proper generic name.
 

tgl

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Correct, you need a short piece of pipe in each end of the tee. You will need to fold back the rubber in the center of the couplings in order to have room to put in the tee and short pieces. If you cut the opening larger than you really need it will let you fold the couplings so you can measure and cut the short pieces to lengths you know will work.
THanks! though I don't quite get the folding back part--if the metal retainer rings are removed (or the retainer rings and shield), the rubber can be folded back?

Just wondering--Cacher (above) mentioned grinding down the letters--that would be the easiest temp fix for my situation--but would that work, since I still can't count on the ground-down area to form a continuous perfect arc with the rest of the pipe, so I still could have a leak?
 

tgl

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hmmm another issue: looking at the old CI drain line--it has a raised seam, as well, so it seems it will never seal well with a Fco. I may try this: reduce briefly from the the 4 in PVC or current Fco tee to 3 in pvc pipe, let the 3 in pipe actually run down inside the 4 in CI a bit (maybe 4 in), and secure that with a 4-3 Fco, so the water bypasses the cut all together. The CI is well supported above, which I can even reinforce, so no sinking or shifting should occur. A Rube G I know, but otherwise I think I have to have the entire CI business replaced to ground connection... which I may have to do anyway, since the whole line moves back a forth a bit, into the ground, which can't be good...
 

Reach4

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Consider posting a photo to better communicate your situation.
 

BMWpowere36m3

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My CI pipe was the same (raised lettering and seam) and I cut off the old hub to redo the house in PVC. I cut off the hub and used a grinder with a 4" disk to grind the lettering and seam as smooth as possible with the rest if the pipe.

I used a shielded fernco for the transition... since its rubber, a little irregularity can be sealed.
 

Jadnashua

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Reducing the pipe diameter in a drain system is just asking for major problems and will not pass code...do not do it.

If you have a close connection and are using a banded coupling to join the two sections, since the banded coupling has a stop ring inside it, you cannot just slide it fully onto one pipe, line up the new section and slide it back...the only way is to slide the removed shielded section on the pipe, install the rubber section in place, then fold the other half back over it...put the other pipe in place, fold the rubber back onto it, then slide the band around the whole thing and tighten it down (typically, it calls for a 10-inch/pounds or so of torque - read the spec for yours).
 

Asktom

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Going from 4" to 3" to 4" is bad practice and may not make things any easier. As far as the folding back part goes... take the rubber out of the metal shield, then loosen up the clamps so you can open them wider. Put the rubber part on the pipe then bend back the portion that is hanging in the air. It will probably want to snap back, but you can slide the loosened shield over it to hold it in place. When you have done both top and bottom you can take an exact measurement of what you need for the tee and little pieces of pipe. Once the tee is in place you can slide the shields out of the way and snap the rubber back over the pipe. Put the shields in place and tighten.
 

Plumber69

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Are Ferncos the black rubber hose with to clamps illeagal? but mj clamp is good?

mission_bandseal.jpg


These are legal. With the metal sleeve to prevent pipe shift.
 
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Jadnashua

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Are Ferncos the black rubber hose with to clamps illeagal? but mj clamp is good?
Again, Fernco is a big company that makes thousands of things, among them, the thing some people have come to call a Fernco and meaning a thick rubber sleeve with two hose clamps on it. Sort of like everyone calling a tissue a Kleenex, when that company makes lots of paper products like napkins, pads, and who knows what. SOrt of like calling all cars a Ford.

Those are legal most places but ONLY outside of the foundation, underground where you have properly supported the two sections of pipe so that they don't sag and create a stepped connection. Inside of a building, you must use a banded coupling - the metal band around the whole thing ensures both ends of the pipe are kept in-line. A similar fitting is used to connect hubless cast iron pipe...the things are robust when installed properly.
 
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