Well problems

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Mar3232

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Alright -- will start digging. The run is short to the basement, maybe 20 feet or so. Clean out the pipe with an auger first maybe? Not?

Would rather just make it an easy push and use the 3/4" --it sounds like I have work to do at the end as well?
Point L on the drawing, the adapter? Trying to figure out what happens there if I get the pipe through.

Hey man -- thanks a ton, the moral support alone is appreciated.
 

Mar3232

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Thanks Craig. I think we both just posted. So how do I get the silicone in there? Reach down or will I have to pull the whole thing up?
 

DonL

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A little trick is to tape a marble to the nose of the pipe so it won't hang up in any shoulders where the steel is coupled together, it also keeps a lot of crap from getting into the pipe.


Good Tip . I thought I was the only Old Dude that played with Marbles.
 

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So when I get the old steel pipe exposed, cut a piece out of it near the junction and caulk around the new pex, where it inserts from the outside? Going to start digging today. Searched Lexel -- wasn't familiar with it, really looks like good stuff.
 

DonL

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So when I get the old steel pipe exposed, cut a piece out of it near the junction and caulk around the new pex, where it inserts from the outside? Going to start digging today. Searched Lexel -- wasn't familiar with it, really looks like good stuff.


Caulk ?

I Don't think so.

Do you know what you are doing ? Just Kidding. lol


Have Fun.
 
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Mar3232

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Read a thread before posting ok?
Lexel as suggested. Consider "caulk" a off the cuff synonym. Is that OK with you?

Anyway -- dug this morning and getting close but one thing is for SURE. It isn't leaking near the casing at all.
Dry earth, let the water run for a few hours and nothing.
 

DonL

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Read a thread before posting ok?
Lexel as suggested. Consider "caulk" a off the cuff synonym. Is that OK with you?

Anyway -- dug this morning and getting close but one thing is for SURE. It isn't leaking near the casing at all.
Dry earth, let the water run for a few hours and nothing.


I did read it. Is it Silicone ?

Don't get your panties in a bunch.


Good Luck on your project. And please excuse me for having my head up my ass.
 

Reach4

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Alright -- will start digging. The run is short to the basement, maybe 20 feet or so. Clean out the pipe with an auger first maybe? Not?

Would rather just make it an easy push and use the 3/4" --it sounds like I have work to do at the end as well?
Point L on the drawing, the adapter? Trying to figure out what happens there if I get the pipe through.

Hey man -- thanks a ton, the moral support alone is appreciated.

I doubt that there is enough rust to call for an auger. But then I don't know. I would inspect the pipe that you cut out and only auger if there was serious narrowing in that pipe. Hmmm.. if your pipe rusted through, maybe that is worthwhile having the auger standing by. Dunno.

I have no experience, but here is how I envision it. If you get there and the leak is not from point L , but is somewhere downstream, I think you will cut out a section of pipe leaving maybe 1 ft screwed into L. You will unscrew with 1 or 2 pipe wrenches as needed. You will dress both ends of the steel pipe with grinder, files, or whatever to round off anything sharp.

You will feed the pipe. I am not sure which end I would start with. If you started outside, you could have the fittings on the PEX already installed out in the open. If you push from indoors, you would have an easier shot to push straight forward.

You will have the adapters to screw to L. I would use teflon tape on any tapered threads. I would prefer the heavier Oatey pink or even the even-thicker yellow intended for gas. It is OK to use yellow on water. You will screw the cable to the well at L.

I think I would seal just at the buried end. I think I could seal inside later if I felt the need. If you had enough space, you could pull the connected PEX away from the house, apply the sealant into the annular space plus goop it for another inch around the pipe, and then insert the PEX with sealant glob into the steel pipe. An alternative would be to use compound like Rectorseal #5. Or use both compound and teflon. Using both is a bit overkill, but I sometimes like overkill.

I am thinking that if there is any thermal expansion, that sealing (locking in place) one end only might be better. But maybe that is needless concern. I would try to fit some material to pad the PEX at the output to prevent abrasion. Maybe they sell something for the purpose. I don't know how much annular space you will have, but I think it will be considerable.

So anyway, it is likely that craigpump will be able to apply experience and come up with improvements.
Edit:
Anyway -- dug this morning and getting close but one thing is for SURE. It isn't leaking near the casing at all.
Dry earth, let the water run for a few hours and nothing.
That is great news.
 

Craigpump

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Steel pipe corrodes from the inside out, I have seen old pipe that is full sized inside and I have seen newer pipe so plugged you can't get a pencil in it. It depends a lot on the water quality.

I would push the pipe from the inside where there's more room to work and uncoil the pipe, you don't want any kinks.

Your hole at the well should be pretty damn big, that's why I have a mini excavator and a young employee.

You can take a short piece of Pex, split it and make a sleeve that will protect the pipe from the sharp edges.

I always back fill with sand or soft, clean dirt at the pitless and no rocks in the hole.

I would also seal both ends, it's leaking in the middle, water will find its way to the basement. I wouldn't worry too much about thermal expansion especially since ground water stays a pretty constant temp.
 

Mar3232

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Ok Craig -- thanks dude. Close to the pipe but still some digging to do. Glad to hear I can fill it back up with sand because I thought I'd that and then build a weatherproof cover over the casing (for what that's worth). When I get everything exposed, I may have more questions. (Like anything I can do while the pitless adapter is exposed).
Tightening etc.

Let me get this straight --
To replace the pitless adapter you have to lift everything out, right?

You guys are great.
 

Reach4

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I would not do anything to the pitless adapter, except observe it. I expect (L) "Pipeolet" is welded to the casing.

When you get the pump pulled, be sure the well people have a replacement (K) seal. Maybe print out the instructions from the manufacturer site in case they pull some off of the site someday. Ignore the directions to lube with vaseline, and instead use silicone grease on the new seal. But would do nothing to the pitless without a symptom.
 

Mar3232

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Ok I'll print that out for future reference -- no need to pull the pump now however because it's working fine.
 

Mar3232

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I wanted to clear one thing up -- if my junction, point "L" is welded that would probably be a good thing right?
I see in some drawings these parts are 2 piece and tightened from the outside, prone to a higher chance of leaking?
 

Reach4

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I wanted to clear one thing up -- if my junction, point "L" is welded that would probably be a good thing right?
I think so. That is my expectation of what you have. But if it is something else, that's fine. It is not leaking, so good. Now that I think about it, I guess when you unscrew the pipe, it would be best to apply a counter torque so as to not damage the existing seal. It is possible that you have a fitting screwed into the (L) pitless piece rather than have the pipe screwed in directly. In that case, I would think you will make the decision based on what you see and what shows up. Do not add any new steel fittings; use brass for any new fittings. Now should you you replace a steel fitting that is holding tight to the (L)? I would not go out of my way to do that. If (L) is welded to the casing, I presume it is going to be steel. If you find your outside piece is not welded on, I would then expect that you have some intermediate product between the SPP and the MCK/SMCK pitless units.

I see in some drawings these parts are 2 piece and tightened from the outside, prone to a higher chance of leaking?
I did not see that drawing for yours. I do have that in mine. If yours is not welded and if you ever wanted to replace that outside piece, then I expect that your system would be compatible with mine. In my pitless, there is a hole drilled in the casing. Both the inside and outside each press an O-ring tightly against the casing. No part of the pitless goes through the hole for either the SPP or the MCK/SMCK pitless units.
 

Mar3232

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Exposed the pipe, well below the frost line, just enough to make it a bitch for my bad back. Will there's way I guess (or a kid to help me). I actually was thinking of cutting the discharge pipe, leaving a gap I can seal.

Idea --

Someone should invent a pex pipe with a self sealing (expandable?) sheath around it. Think about it, it could be done.

or

how about pex or a container for it that has a series of strong circular rubber gaskets (every 8" or so?) that will ultimately seal the water flowing in the annular space or at least, reduce it to the point that it's not a serious problem.

you just push these into the old discharge pipe and that's it.

manufacturers can get my address for my check.


I just had another thought --

say you had a 6" (whatever) piece of pipe cut out of the discharge.
you run the pex through, (as large a diameter that you can fit) and the do something creative with (2) rubber flexible fittings and stainless steel clamps? One on the inside, covering the pex, sealing the annular space right up to the ends of the pipe -- and then another larger and longer one sealing the whole deal.

Just throwing this stuff out -- I'm kind of known for having an overactive brain.
 
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